nycphils wrote:Agreed. He'd fill a role in the OF this year and maybe he'd sign a reasonable deal if the market doesn't develop if he sticks around, or he can be flipped for something at the deadline. I'd easily take him on to get 2 of the 3 of Betts, Bogarts and Owens.

WhiteyFan wrote:

nycphils wrote:Agreed. He'd fill a role in the OF this year and maybe he'd sign a reasonable deal if the market doesn't develop if he sticks around, or he can be flipped for something at the deadline. I'd easily take him on to get 2 of the 3 of Betts, Bogarts and Owens.

So, Hamels for Cespedes, Betts and Bogaerts? Sounds reasonable. Go float that on a Sox message board and gauge the reaction.

WilliamC wrote:Scherzer's deal is going to make Cole's look sweet. Same age, Cole is better.

Grotewold wrote:Still don't see why Boston wouldn't just kick an extra $10M or so to Lester

"If he can find a deal where he gets two pitchers who can pitch in the top three of his rotation at some point, or he gets one guy like that plus another guy who is going to play every day in the big leagues on a [winning] team, then he's got to do it," said one NL exec of Amaro. "Or if he gets a little less than that, but he can get another piece who can help in the near future, then he's got to do it."

But then the same exec paused for a moment and came to his senses.

"It's the wrong year to be doing it because there's so much pitching out there."

Jon Lester ... Max Scherzer ... James Shields ... Francisco Liriano ... Brandon McCarthy ... Ervin Santana ... Hiroki Kuroda. Those would be just some of the starting pitchers any team can find on the shelves of the old free-agent supermarket right now.

Jordan Zimmermann ... Doug Fister ... Jeff Samardzija ... Mat Latos ... Rick Porcello ... maybe even Johnny Cueto. Those would be some of the starting pitcher alternatives out there if you're a team like the Red Sox which wouldn't mind trading some of its excess position players for a veteran starter.

So given how many other options are out there, "it's going to be very difficult," said one exec, "for Ruben to do this the way he's going to need to do it."

And what way is that, you ask? Another industry source who has talked with Amaro laughed at that question.

"Ruben is in a spot where he's not going to play his hand unless it looks like the deal of the century."

And that, say multiple teams, is pretty much the type of deal Amaro has been asking for consistently, from last July to now -- a return so glittering that nobody can question it.

What he wants, said one exec, is "your two best [young] guys, plus 'you take all the money.' " And he's taken that hard line, other clubs believe, as much because of the heat he's feeling personally, with a year left on his contract, as it is because of the position his team finds itself in.

"You look at the players he got back in some of these other deals and basically, he got nothing," said an official of one club, bluntly. "Really, their window to make these moves was two years ago. Two years ago, they had a chance to make three, four, five moves and break up their core when there was still big value there."

"I think Ruben is in a position," said another NL executive, "where he'll reach as high as he wants to reach this winter. He doesn't have to move him, but he's prepared to move him if the right deal comes along. But it's got to be almost the perfect deal, or he'll wait until July."

So are the Red Sox prepared to make "the perfect deal" this winter, now that they've stockpiled the depth of trade chips that could make it happen? Is someone else? We're about to find out. But don't bet on it. Eventually, other teams say, Amaro is going to have to accept reality and make a practical deal, not the perfect deal, whether he wants to or not.

"He's never going to make a deal where Phillies fans say, 'Hey, that's great, Ruben,'" said an exec of one team. "He needs to realize that ain't happening."

"This is one of the best starting pitchers in baseball," Amaro said. "He's at a level with the [Clayton] Kershaws and [Jon] Lesters and [David] Prices. And some of the metrics say he's even better in some respects. So like I've said, he's one of the best pitchers in baseball, and we don't have to trade him. And if we do decide to move him, it will be for something we think is appropriate."

WilliamC wrote:Again, back to that bull$hit. Amaro/or the Phils never make a trade where a "rival exec" isn't in some form or other saying things that sound like they want the price to go down or are purposefully driving it down by using the media.

WhiteyFan wrote:

nycphils wrote:Agreed. He'd fill a role in the OF this year and maybe he'd sign a reasonable deal if the market doesn't develop if he sticks around, or he can be flipped for something at the deadline. I'd easily take him on to get 2 of the 3 of Betts, Bogarts and Owens.

So, Hamels for Cespedes, Betts and Bogaerts? Sounds reasonable. Go float that on a Sox message board and gauge the reaction.

CFP wrote:

"This is one of the best starting pitchers in baseball," Amaro said. "He's at a level with the [Clayton] Kershaws and [Jon] Lesters and [David] Prices. And some of the metrics say he's even better in some respects. So like I've said, he's one of the best pitchers in baseball, and we don't have to trade him. And if we do decide to move him, it will be for something we think is appropriate."

Amaro quoting "metrics". Wow.

BigEd76 wrote:Too busy doing book signings in Philly and Newtown

CFP wrote:

"This is one of the best starting pitchers in baseball," Amaro said. "He's at a level with the [Clayton] Kershaws and [Jon] Lesters and [David] Prices. And some of the metrics say he's even better in some respects. So like I've said, he's one of the best pitchers in baseball, and we don't have to trade him. And if we do decide to move him, it will be for something we think is appropriate."

Amaro quoting "metrics". Wow.

Bill McNeal wrote:Honestly, unless rube gets one of those "glittering" deals then in fine with not trading cole. No point in moving him for a bunch of never gonna be's just to do it. As a fan I still wan a watch him pitch every fifth day and if they somehow catch lighting in a bottle and make a "wheeze kids" run, I'd rather have him at the top of the rotation than a couple of middling prospects. We've got enough of those guys already.