Hot Stove 2009 Discussion Here

by **Houshphandzadeh** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 17:06:58

smitty wrote:
philliesphhan wrote:If we didn't trade for Holliday and the A's did, I think that would be pretty funny. Even if Holliday is improving on the road, Oakland's field wouldn't be very kind to him.

Gio Gonzales, Josh Outman and that Cardenas guy would probably do the trick.

Throw in Bourn and Sandberg!

by **dajafi** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 17:08:11

ek wrote:Kyle(Philadelphia): Do the Phillies have the prospects to get Holliday?

SportsNation Keith Law: Carrasco, Donald, Taylor? Why not? I'm not saying they will do it, but the Rockies would have to listen to that, right?

I know I wouldn't trade all three, and I probably wouldn't trade two of the three. Something like Donald or Taylor, Edgar Garcia and a guy somewhat further away or with a lower ceiling, like Galvis or Naylor, is probably as much as I'd part with.

by **Shore** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 17:12:02

Keith Law wrote:And Utley is the best player in baseball right now.

later...

Albert Pujols wrote:Better than me?

Keith Law wrote: Yes.

by **kruker** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 17:40:49

Just when I thought Keith Law couldn't get any dumber, he goes and does something like this... and totally redeems himself!

by **kruker** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 18:27:13

I just hope that this isn't a hint that the organization trusts Greg Golson as a major leaguer this coming season.

by **Squire** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 18:28:48

Ideally I'd want to retain Marson and then Donald in that order who I both peg as 2010 starters on this team. I'd be OK with Carrasco, Golson, Naylor, +. That may not be enough I guess.

SQUIRE

by **CFP** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 18:36:37

The headline on SI, BTW, does say "Phillies chasing Holliday hard", and when you click it, the sub-headline your browser header says "The Philadelphia Phillies are trying to acquire Matt Holliday." Interesting.

by **Trent Steele** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 19:33:13

This Holiday stuff excites me. A great player and you can restock your system with 2 draft picks next year when he leaves and you also get 2 this year when Burrell leaves.

So, would you rather have Burrell on a 3 year deal that will probably look bad pretty quickly and keep your prospects or let Burrell leave, and get Holiday for 2009 and 4 1st round picks?

I'll buy the latter.

by **Mountainphan** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 19:39:30

Normally, I wouldn't be too eager to acquire a Rockies' hitter, but in Holliday's case, I'd be interested. He's the real deal in any ballpark.

by **Houshphandzadeh** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 19:40:37

I just have a knee-jerk bad reaction to giving up assets for rentals. We're gonna give up at least two players who are much surer and more useful than future draft picks. And we'll still need a left-fielder in one year. I guess it all depends on the final deal, like always.

When's the last time the Phils traded for a big hitter in his prime?

by **Squire** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 19:44:02

Trent Steele wrote:This Holiday stuff excites me. A great player and you can restock your system with 2 draft picks next year when he leaves and you also get 2 this year when Burrell leaves.

So, would you rather have Burrell on a 3 year deal that will probably look bad pretty quickly and keep your prospects or let Burrell leave, and get Holiday for 2009 and 4 1st round picks?

I'll buy the latter.

Well that's not exactly the transaction. Its more like Holliday plus 2 comp picks and 2 2nd round picks rather than Burrell, Carrasco, Donald, and another prospect or two.

SQUIRE

by **lethal** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 20:11:04

ek wrote:I'd deal minor leaguers for him only. Not Victorino or Madson, etc. however, if they wanted Werth plus minor leaguers, I'd consider it

I wouldn't deal Vic or Werth. If you deal one of them for an OF, you still have a hole in the OF and then its a harder one to fill defensively.

by **Trent Steele** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 20:33:17

I don't want to trade any of them, but Madson and Werth are both going to be FA next year. It's unlkely that either's value will ever be higher than it is right now (especially Madson). If I was GM, I would trade either in the right deal.

by **ReadingPhilly** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 21:06:43

MLB.com's Ken Mandel says the Phillies have Rocco Baldelli, Jerry Hairston Jr., and Kevin Mench on the radar in the event they don't re-sign Burrell. The Phillies have long liked Baldelli, though the Rays hope to talk contract soon. Reds GM Walt Jocketty recently met with Hairston's agent, and feels he made progress. And the Hanshin Tigers hope to lure Mench to Japan.

by **jerseyhoya** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 21:07:49

Reading things like that make the idea of giving up a little too much for Holliday all the more palatable.

by **Trent Steele** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 21:14:55

jerseyhoya wrote:Reading things like that make the idea of giving up a little too much for Holliday all the more palatable.

Right on. They aren't going to spend much money on LF. Holiday is a creative and reasonable solution for a team that is poised to be a contender again.

by **Woody** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 21:17:38

ek wrote:but if they trade Madson, then they have no setup man

If they keep Madson they may not have a setup man, either

by **Woody** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 21:26:40

I don't know. But, I mean, he's Ryan Madson. And to me, his late season and playoff dominance (not to mention the 97 mph heater) kind of felt a little too good to last. Plus, blah blah relievers are unpredictable up and down every other year blah blah

Although he does have a career 3.18 ERA as a reliever. I'm just so scared!!

by **Barry Jive** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 22:02:29

MAKE IT HAPPEN

Seriously, I understand wanting to hang onto Donald. But the Phillies are going to have borderline HOFers at SS and 2B for the next five years. This probably sounds like the Ryne Sandberg argument all over again, but you're probably going to have to trade Donald eventually anyway. Why not now, for a guy who'd immediately become one of the top three hitters in your World Fuck-ing Champion lineup, and would fill an immediate need?

Sure, you're probably not going to get an extension. But Manny Ramirez didn't sign an extension in LA, and he's still probably going to be playing there for the next three years. With Holliday in the lineup this year, you're in title defense mode from day one, and possibly for the next few seasons as well.

Trade Carrasco, trade Happ, trade Donald, trade Golson. Make something happen.

by **Grotewold** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 22:10:10

Agreed.

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