ek wrote:toronto called amaro right before the lee trade but still wanted Drabek

Source? Or just a guess based on this info?

mozartpc27 wrote:If that's always been a lie, the price for Halladay just hit rock bottom. I'd assume the Jays would not want to deal with the Phillies out of spite now, but I'm guessing the Red Sox or Yankees could now have him, one for prospects sans Buccholz, the other for only one of Hughes or Chamberlain, not both. Maybe the Dodgers or Angels could still make a run too?

my worry is the dodgers make a bid for him. If not, hope we can revisit in winter.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5QGkOGZubQ[/youtube]

Wizlah wrote:

mozartpc27 wrote:If that's always been a lie, the price for Halladay just hit rock bottom. I'd assume the Jays would not want to deal with the Phillies out of spite now, but I'm guessing the Red Sox or Yankees could now have him, one for prospects sans Buccholz, the other for only one of Hughes or Chamberlain, not both. Maybe the Dodgers or Angels could still make a run too?

my worry is the dodgers make a bid for him. If not, hope we can revisit in winter.

Another reason to put a bid in. Keep a minimum floor on the price for Halladay.

Per Gargano, Phils and Jays talked one last time before the Lee deal and the Phillies made a final offer of Happ, Knapp, Donald, Carrasco, Marson for Halladay.

Riccardi turned it down and the Phils moved on.

loser of smug-war

J.P. Ricciardi said he now not only expects Halladay to be a Blue Jay for the rest of this season, but for the rest of his contract, which runs through next year.

"I would have to talk to ownership, but I personally would be less inclined to trade him in the offseason," Ricciardi said when reached by phone by the Post. "I would think let's put our best foot forward in 2010. We expect to get our injured pitchers back (such as Shaun Marcum and Jesse Litsch) and let's try to win.'

Ricciardi said he was neither surprised nor pained that the Phillies turned from frontrunners for Halladay to completing a deal today for Cliff Lee.

"It doesn't hurt us," Ricciardi said. "We said the whole way that we would have to be wowed (by a proposal) and we haven't been wowed. I don't think this is going to get done (before Friday's deadline). I have told everyone we would have to be moved, and no one has moved us with an offer. And that is fine. This is not something we have to do."

Ricciardi described Halladay as "currently the guy who is going to win the AL Cy Young again this year" and that to move that kind of pitcher he expects a substantial return. He did not hear that offer from the Phillies. A separate source told the Post that the Phillies would have had to include Double-A starter Kyle Drabek in an offer and Philadelphia refused to do that.

When asked if he thought the Indians got enough with a package of Jason Knapp, Lou Marson, Carlos Carrasco and Jason Donald, Ricciardi responded, "beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Cleveland is in a position in which it wanted to do different players than we wanted. It is not my place to comment on what they did. We thought we needed a certain level of players and we have not gotten offered that level."

So, no Halladay trade I guess. Ricciardi fired... Friday at 5:00PM? Some time next week? Or the day after this season ends?

Brantt wrote:Per Gargano, Phils and Jays talked one last time before the Lee deal and the Phillies made a final offer of Happ, Knapp, Donald, Carrasco, Marson for Halladay.

Riccardi turned it down and the Phils moved on.

Just as I predicted.

On another note, just for fun even though it won't happen, the Phils could find a way to pay for both Lee and Halladay.

For 2009, it would be fairly easy, since Lee is only going to cost ~$2MM for the rest of the year.

For 2010 we start with the assumption they were prepared to pay Halladay's salary. So, you've got to make room for Lee's $9MM. Blanton's going to get close to that in arb next year. So, if you trade Blanton and either Victorino or Werth (who'd be replaced by Taylor), you save more than enough to carry both Lee's and Halladay's salaries.

Just sayin'.

ek wrote:

Brantt wrote:Per Gargano, Phils and Jays talked one last time before the Lee deal and the Phillies made a final offer of Happ, Knapp, Donald, Carrasco, Marson for Halladay.

Riccardi turned it down and the Phils moved on.

jesus, that's a lot of prospects

When Knapp and Carrasco are dealing in 3 years, and mowing down the Blue Jays, and we're sitting on 3 WFCs, it will hurt even more.

Here's the reason, too, why I would offer Toronto what they originally asked for, only taking Drabek out and putting any prospect of their choice other than Taylor in (so, Happ/Brown/somebody, maybe even a second somebody if there is anyone else worth talking about):

You'd be in a position to trade Victorino with Taylor waiting in the wings, and for the rest of this year you'd have:

Halladay
Hamels
Lee
Blanton
Pedro/Moyer

plus our lineup. That's as close to unbeatable as an MLB team will get.

Obviously, it's not happening as Toronto would never do it, if only to save face, but it's fun to think about while it's still technically possible between now and Friday.

"Therefore, those skilled in war bring the enemy to the field of battle and are not brought there by him."

"Speed is the essence of war. Take advantage of the enemy's unpreparedness; travel by unexpected routes and strike him where he has taken no precautions."

To rely on rustics and not prepare is the greatest of crimes; to be prepared beforehand for any contingency is the greatest of virtues."

- Sun Tzu

kingclipAll of the pieces still being in place doesn't mean the #Phillies are getting Halladay, insider says "They're done unless Toronto flips."
3 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Goldstein

If we still somehow got Halladay, I'll literally defecate

Stark on 950 says Blue Jays ownership took the dealings out of JP's hands and then asked the Phillies for more saying Drabek AND Brown had to be included.

"Indians needed to move money off the payroll"

I feel bad for Halladay. He took less money to stay in Toronto a few years ago, and they reward him by not trading him and threatening to keep him next year. When he hits the free market, he'll be nearing the end of his peak.

If you listen realllly closely, you can actually HEAR Halladay's trade value plummeting.

Ricciardi was last seen standing on a street corner in Toronto with his dick in his hand.

TenuredVulture wrote:Ricciardi was last seen standing on a street corner in Toronto with his dick in his hand.

With his Doc in his hand

So you guys think Taylor, Kendrick and Happ will get this thing done?