HALLADAY VIII: GUS IS SCRATCHNG LIKE A CHEAP JOHN

Website · by **Wolfgang622** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:26:14

In other news, I've given up on even pretending to do work until this thign is settled, which I fully expect to be later today.

The other thing is the Phillies need to get this done now, because I don't think they are done dealing, regardless. I think for sure they will add a reliever (Sherrill?), and maybe another bat for the bench as well, which means they need some time to work out other deals.

by **JFLNYC** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:27:31

Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

by **lowcountry** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:28:50

Fine. Get Lee now and Halladay later. :lol:

by **The Dude** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:28:56

JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I agree with this, but I'm a little more confident that Beeston told JPR that Halladay has to be moved. There was the story this week about the team's finances, I really think they're hard pressed to get the deal done, blame it on JPR if if sucks, and get a new GM

Website · by **Wolfgang622** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:29:34

JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I'm nothing like I was (on Sunday, I would have said Halladay to the Phillies was like 99%). Now I'm like... 52%. I'm trying to keep the faith here, but I realize JP is an assclown.

by **FTN** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:29:50

The Dude wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I agree with this, but I'm a little more confident that Beeston told JPR that Halladay has to be moved. There was the story this week about the team's finances, I really think they're hard pressed to get the deal done, blame it on JPR if if sucks, and get a new GM

That actually seems like the ideal scenario.

Halladay is traded, Ricciardi is canned, the front office blames the teams troubles on the bad contracts he gave out, he becomes the scapegoat, and they move on

by **Benny Lava** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:30:33

Does anyone else think that if the Phils get Lee, that Halladay doesn't get moved? I can't imagine the Jays trading him to Boston without a great package including Bucholtz.

by **Grotewold** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:30:39

This time next year JP will be fetching Gillick budweisers

Website · by **Wolfgang622** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:31:22

FTN wrote:
The Dude wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I agree with this, but I'm a little more confident that Beeston told JPR that Halladay has to be moved. There was the story this week about the team's finances, I really think they're hard pressed to get the deal done, blame it on JPR if if sucks, and get a new GM

That actually seems like the ideal scenario.

Halladay is traded, Ricciardi is canned, the front office blames the teams troubles on the bad contracts he gave out, he becomes the scapegoat, and they move on

EXCEPT... I don't think there is an acceptable scenario for the Blue Jays in which Halladay is a Red Sox, because you know they will re-sign him. Do they really want their fans seeing him pitch against the Blue Jays 3-4 times a year for the next 5 years?

Website · by **Wolfgang622** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:31:50

Grotewold wrote:This time next week JP will be fetching Gillick budweisers

FYP

by **The Dude** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:32:19

mozartpc27 wrote:
FTN wrote:
The Dude wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I agree with this, but I'm a little more confident that Beeston told JPR that Halladay has to be moved. There was the story this week about the team's finances, I really think they're hard pressed to get the deal done, blame it on JPR if if sucks, and get a new GM

That actually seems like the ideal scenario.

Halladay is traded, Ricciardi is canned, the front office blames the teams troubles on the bad contracts he gave out, he becomes the scapegoat, and they move on

EXCEPT... I don't think there is an acceptable scenario for the Blue Jays in which Halladay is a Red Sox, because you know they will re-sign him. Do they really want their fans seeing him pitch against the Blue Jays 3-4 times a year for the next 5 years?

It's either that, or hold on to him and hope the draft picks next year are better than the trade, and watch him sign with Boston anyway

by **lowcountry** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:32:57

Tweet from JP's pants: "What just happened up there? What's that smell?" #nasty

by **Phan In Phlorida** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:33:15

mozartpc27 wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:
mozartpc27 wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:IMO. Phils are going to make one last big push for Halladay today. If it fails, they're gonna go with Lee.

I think as much as anything it offends me the Phillies are prepared to cede Halladay to the mother-$#@!-ing Red Sox. I guess I must be satisfied if the Phillies manage to keep Taylor, Brown, and Drabek in the process, but since that has a snowball's chance in hell of happening, I feel very strongly I'd rather give up Drabek and Brown/Taylor to get HALLADAY than give up Brown/Taylor to get Lee.

The craziest thing is that if the Phillies go for the Lee deal, then Boston can pull Buccholz off the table, and JP will still have to make the deal. If they can force Boston into a Lee deal first, then they can pull Drabek. ARRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH.

I guess Rube is hoping that JP will panic at the thought of Halladay in a Sox uniform and accept a Happ/Taylor/pieces deal from him first rather than see that day come. Because JP is setting up to get raped by Theo. Raped.

I don't like it much either, but at some point you have to make a choice and go for it or risk not getting either of them. I'm oddly confident that, with a real deal for Lee in hand, they'll get Riccardi to cave.

I mean, Halladay in Boston is a DISASTER for Toronto, right? And not only that, but if the Phillies drop out now, the price for Halladay will drop for Boston, so it will be Halladay to Boston and those Boston beans I've heard so much about to Toronto.

And Boston dealing Buchholz to a division foe is somewhat asinine. Couple that with Boston saying they won't even consider dealing Buccholz and Westmoreland ain't goin'/can't go, the BoSox/Jays rumors are likely just smoke or mediot drivel spawn from a belief Boston is entitled to be included in any major talks.

by **SideshowBob** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:33:38

Benny Lava wrote:Does anyone else think that if the Phils get Lee, that Halladay doesn't get moved? I can't imagine the Jays trading him to Boston without a great package including Bucholtz.

Yeah, I was kind if thinking that too. If any offer from Boston in that scenario just sucks, Toronto might as well not trade and wait until the off-season. I mean, the whole point of moving Halladay now is that his trade value would be at its highest, but if they don't get much in return there's no point in pulling the trigger.

by **S2D** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:33:41

Benny Lava wrote:Does anyone else think that if the Phils get Lee, that Halladay doesn't get moved? I can't imagine the Jays trading him to Boston without a great package including Bucholtz.

Ricciardi will call up both NY and Boston and put the fear of the other one acquiring Halladay in them. If the haul is good enough, I think he'd move him.

by **JFLNYC** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:35:40

Benny Lava wrote:Does anyone else think that if the Phils get Lee, that Halladay doesn't get moved? I can't imagine the Jays trading him to Boston without a great package including Bucholtz.

I believe it. I think JPR has overplayed his hand.

And, I want to point out that very, very early in the Halladay threads, I suggested Rube get on the horn with Shapiro and be serious about Lee. It's the only way to move JPR off his proposal and is a very good Plan B, if necessary.

by **Trent Steele** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:36:15

As of now, source says, #Phillies doing "nothing with" #BlueJays. More indication something could be up with Philly and Cliff Lee #Indians.

Ed price

Website · by **Wolfgang622** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:36:23

The Dude wrote:
mozartpc27 wrote:
FTN wrote:
The Dude wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I agree with this, but I'm a little more confident that Beeston told JPR that Halladay has to be moved. There was the story this week about the team's finances, I really think they're hard pressed to get the deal done, blame it on JPR if if sucks, and get a new GM

That actually seems like the ideal scenario.

Halladay is traded, Ricciardi is canned, the front office blames the teams troubles on the bad contracts he gave out, he becomes the scapegoat, and they move on

EXCEPT... I don't think there is an acceptable scenario for the Blue Jays in which Halladay is a Red Sox, because you know they will re-sign him. Do they really want their fans seeing him pitch against the Blue Jays 3-4 times a year for the next 5 years?

It's either that, or hold on to him and hope the draft picks next year are better than the trade, and watch him sign with Boston anyway

It's different if Boston beats out other clubs to sign Halladay than if Toronto just GIVES him to Boston for some cut-rate package. Boston will have absolutely no reason to include Buccholz in a package once the Phillies acquire Lee. None. But the salary still needs to be shed. Push, meet shove.

by **FTN** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:37:27

They did what?????

by **The Dude** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 13:38:00

mozartpc27 wrote:
The Dude wrote:
mozartpc27 wrote:
FTN wrote:
The Dude wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:Don't be too confident. Unless Beeston has told JPR he must trade Halladay now, JPR is probably pig-headed enough to do nothing at the deadline. That being said, I think Beeston has told him to move Halladay now and that, since the Phils probably have a Lee deal in place, every minute which goes by means Rube and JPR are negotiating in earnest.

I agree with this, but I'm a little more confident that Beeston told JPR that Halladay has to be moved. There was the story this week about the team's finances, I really think they're hard pressed to get the deal done, blame it on JPR if if sucks, and get a new GM

That actually seems like the ideal scenario.

Halladay is traded, Ricciardi is canned, the front office blames the teams troubles on the bad contracts he gave out, he becomes the scapegoat, and they move on

EXCEPT... I don't think there is an acceptable scenario for the Blue Jays in which Halladay is a Red Sox, because you know they will re-sign him. Do they really want their fans seeing him pitch against the Blue Jays 3-4 times a year for the next 5 years?

It's either that, or hold on to him and hope the draft picks next year are better than the trade, and watch him sign with Boston anyway

It's different if Boston beats out other clubs to sign Halladay than if Toronto just GIVES him to Toronto for some cut-rate package. Boston will have absolutely no reason to include Buccholz in a package once the Phillies acquire Lee. None. But the salary still needs to be shed. Push, meet shove.

Two things: that's why they fire JPR and blame him, and (2) the other option is a lot worse since 99% of fans don't care about the draft and will react to it as the Jays losing him for nothing

Archived

HALLADAY VIII: GUS IS SCRATCHNG LIKE A CHEAP JOHN