No, let's just ignore the most recent year. That makes sense. You even said it yourself, you didn't want him if he was expensive. 3 year deal, scandalous.

What does ggsa mean? Does anyone besides you know?

sydnor wrote:

smitty wrote:Jeff,

Tell me all about Chooch's defense. Tell me about his framing skills. Tell me about his ability to handle a pitching staff and call a game. Compare and contrast him to all the great catchers you want to replace him with.

I'm really interested in your expertise in this area.

Seriously.

Tell me about how many wins that adds. Tell me that there's a consensus that Ruiz is the best. Tell me that you've watched catchers besides Ruiz enough to form an opinion on framing skills. Tell me that whatever the framing stuff says, it's rock solid, that it's asked and answered and as quantifiable as his atrocious hitting last year. Tell me that unlike offense and running, defense for a catcher magically stays great even as one ages. Tell me all that, because I really want to know.

There is a CHANCE Ruiz is good at framing and that it may be worth 2/3s of a win (http://crashburnalley.com/2011/11/02/ca ... -catchers/). There is also a chance that it is not and he is not.

I've already learned this stuff from people who actually know what they are talking/writing about. I'm curious regarding YOUR expertise in this area. You seem to have all the answers.

There's a LOT more to catcher defense and value than just framing. Ruiz really isn't one of the best in this area. KRATZ! On the other hand is.

But as a total package, Ruiz is an above average catcher.

Maybe he IS done at 35. I'm betting he's not.

sydnor wrote:No, let's just ignore the most recent year. That makes sense. You even said it yourself, you didn't want him if he was expensive. 3 year deal, scandalous.

What does ggsa mean? Does anyone besides you know?

Yes. A very famous man knew what GGSA means. But you can't google it or find it in the urban dictionary so you are out of luck.

We should always, ALWAYS use small sample numbers when evaluating a hitter. In fact, from July 24th on, Chooch OPSed .781. Amongst the best hitting catchers in MLB. But we should ignore his most recent numbers. GGSA.

Smitty, do you agree with the contract? Would you have agreed if it was 3/30? 4/40?

Because during our arguments in the summer, you did not indicate this would be acceptable.

I think Chooch will be better this year. The suspension and injuries hurt him last year as much as the lack of drugs, I think. My guess is something a bit better than his 2011 season, maybe 2.8-3.2 WAR and an .800 OPS. Of course, he could also decline quickly and be out of baseball in two years. So there you go.

But 3 years is still too long for a player of his age at his position, even if he has fewer miles on the tires.

smitty wrote:
I've already learned this stuff from people who actually know what they are talking/writing about. I'm curious regarding YOUR expertise in this area. You seem to have all the answers.

There's a LOT more to catcher defense and value than just framing. Ruiz really isn't one of the best in this area. KRATZ! On the other hand is.

But as a total package, Ruiz is an above average catcher.

Maybe he IS done at 35. I'm betting he's not.

Most experts do not agree with you. Keith Law, who is more of an expert than you, thought the contract laughable.

sydnor wrote:No, let's just ignore the most recent year. That makes sense. You even said it yourself, you didn't want him if he was expensive. 3 year deal, scandalous.

What does ggsa mean? Does anyone besides you know?

He was hurt for part of the year, and wasn't allowed to use adderral for his ADHD. This year he is healthy and can use his concentration pills. Two years ago Chooch was a top 5 catcher. Last year he still had a positive WAR despite the injury issues.

Also, I know what GGSA means because instead of being a douche about it I whispered to sate my curiosity.

sydnor wrote:

smitty wrote:
I've already learned this stuff from people who actually know what they are talking/writing about. I'm curious regarding YOUR expertise in this area. You seem to have all the answers.

There's a LOT more to catcher defense and value than just framing. Ruiz really isn't one of the best in this area. KRATZ! On the other hand is.

But as a total package, Ruiz is an above average catcher.

Maybe he IS done at 35. I'm betting he's not.

Most experts do not agree with you. Keith Law, who is more of an expert than you, thought the contract laughable.

You call smitty out for being "incapable of judging catchers", but whenever he tries to get you to answer anything about catching you hide behind other people's opinions without context. Stop being a douche with your obsession with bashing Chooch.

Do I have to ask via PM what GGSA means so that god forbid Jeff doesn't find out?

Guess not

TROUT

sydnor wrote:Smitty, do you agree with the contract? Would you have agreed if it was 3/30? 4/40?

Because during our arguments in the summer, you did not indicate this would be acceptable.

I would have rather signed him to a one or two year deal. But I'd also rather have Chooch than any other available catcher pretty much. He's a good guy to have around as they are attempting to replace him. Rupp is probably a real good backup. Joseph. Real disappointed he got all concussed last year. He might not stick behind the plate. If he does Chooch will be good to have around as Joseph breaks in.

The Phils have quite a few very young catchers who are potential very good prospects. Chooch may be able to help out a few of those guys as well.

The contract was real expensive and long for a 35 year old.

I'm not arguing that any more. It's done. If you want to keep arguing about that go ahead. I'm not interested.

I'm only interested now in how good he can be. I think he will be pretty good next year, maybe even for two years.

phatj wrote:Do I have to ask via PM what GGSA means so that god forbid Jeff doesn't find out?

I assume you're referring to my one post. I only mentioned it because the way I read it Jeff was using it to make Smitty to look like a doddering old fool. If he was really that curious about the meaning he could have asked without sounding like an ass. Then again it's Jeff, so he probably couldn't have.

50 catchers with more than 70 AB had a positive WAR last year. That stat in that context is meaningless. What's important is that he was tied for 22nd in WAR last year. You don't hand a guy a contract that makes him about the 6th highest paid catcher coming off that turd of a season when he's 35. let alone for 3 years.

sydnor wrote:50 catchers with more than 70 AB had a positive WAR last year. That stat in that context is meaningless. What's important is that he was tied for 22nd in WAR last year. You don't hand a guy a contract that makes him about the 6th highest paid catcher coming off that turd of a season when he's 35. let alone for 3 years.

No one is bringing up his positive WAR as a huge superlative, only to say that DESPITE the injuries and DESPITE the suspension, he was still not a complete turd. Was his season good? No. Was it the worst ever? No. He had a productive 2011, and a great 2012. In spite of that, you take his suspension/injury year as proof positive that he's done.

syndor, i'm promoting smitty and giving him some of your underlings

viewtopic.php_f=1&t=13736&p=1536267&hilit=catcher#p1536267

slugs, there you go. More research. I'm not going to bother to study catcher defense because I have other things to do like not get promoted.

Bucky, that's a low blow but so be it. I actually don't sweat losing the direct reports. Managing people is for suckers (believe me if i never do another annual report it will be too soon). The promotion hurts though.

Barry Jive wrote:jeff, how long are you going to stick by the "Ruiz is a dirty cheater" thing even though he's gotten clearance to take adderall for his medical condition

Even if he's received clearance, let's all admit there's a chance it's just a bs condition. Last I recall reading, MLB players were prescribed Adderall at least twice as often as the general population.

But regardless, I hope he takes a shitload of Adderall, because that's the only hope we have. Hope he gives some to Howard and to Rollins, too.

of course there's a chance, but that's between Chooch and his doctors. It's also more difficult to earn an exemption after you've tested positive (presumably even harder if you've tested positive twice like Chooch has). MLB players also have top-notch medical treatment, so while that might not fully explain the discrepancy with the general population it certainly could be a factor. Another factor is that a large portion of the general population who uses Adderall doesn't have a prescription for it (anecdotally, the vast majority of people I know who have used Adderall). Given MLB's stringent drug testing program it's less likely the same percentage of baseball players use Adderall without a prescription.