TenuredVulture wrote:Here's a take: Bush was worse than Trump. I know we have at least 3 more years of Trump, but consider--Iraq, Katrina, financial meltdown. It's going to be difficult for Trump to top that.
Maybe that's why the Republican party is so enthusiastic about Trump these days. All he's got on his record is Puerto Rico, and the pro-Trump media are keeping quiet about that.

Werthless wrote:

TenuredVulture wrote:Here's a take: Bush was worse than Trump. I know we have at least 3 more years of Trump, but consider--Iraq, Katrina, financial meltdown. It's going to be difficult for Trump to top that.
Maybe that's why the Republican party is so enthusiastic about Trump these days.

Gosh darn he's gonna try.

As someone who laments the downfall of certain institutional norms, I think you'd be one of the last people to make this argument. Trump has furthered a lot of pre-existing attitudes in politics and pop culture -- particularly among GOP voters/politicians, but not limited to it... Distrust of large institutions, a confusion of fact with fiction, the degraded status of expertise, desire for confirmatory evidence from like-minded people, self segregated cloistering of micro-communities, dissatisfaction with the re-distributive effects of globalization and technology, unwillingness to study history for lessons...

These issues transcend politics. I can't talk to my dad about sports in the same way that I used to be able. Part of it is because I've changed. I view sports from a different perspective than he does. I read fangraphs, and he listens to sports radio. But it's more than that. I believe there is something else that drives some of the divides, and it's not political, in the sense of right/left. It's how we make decisions, and evaluate decisions. And I suspect that parts of our culture (twitter, talk radio, like-minded communities, information overload, inability to assess bias very well) creates a society that struggles to communicate effectively with people they disagree with. Even places like this forum, which is more polite and like-minded than most places, still has people trolling quite regularly. Hey, 10 years I loved the one-liners, too. But there's something about a growing lack of empathy that is a problem, and it's not going away.

To tie it back to TV's original comment, sure, Bush may have done some things causing direct harm (Iraq), and indirectly handled other bad situations poorly and made them worse (Katrina), but I don't think his presidency created a fundamental or permanent shift in national politics. Obama had more of an impact just on the discussion of what the government can do with respect to healthcare. Even if a Democrat wins in 2020, the damage of the Trump Presidency will last for a long time.

swishnicholson wrote:

Werthless wrote:

TenuredVulture wrote:Here's a take: Bush was worse than Trump. I know we have at least 3 more years of Trump, but consider--Iraq, Katrina, financial meltdown. It's going to be difficult for Trump to top that.
Maybe that's why the Republican party is so enthusiastic about Trump these days.

Gosh darn he's gonna try.

As someone who laments the downfall of certain institutional norms, I think you'd be one of the last people to make this argument. Trump has furthered a lot of pre-existing attitudes in politics and pop culture -- particularly among GOP voters/politicians, but not limited to it... Distrust of large institutions, a confusion of fact with fiction, the degraded status of expertise, desire for confirmatory evidence from like-minded people, self segregated cloistering of micro-communities, dissatisfaction with the re-distributive effects of globalization and technology, unwillingness to study history for lessons...

These issues transcend politics. I can't talk to my dad about sports in the same way that I used to be able. Part of it is because I've changed. I view sports from a different perspective than he does. I read fangraphs, and he listens to sports radio. But it's more than that. I believe there is something else that drives some of the divides, and it's not political, in the sense of right/left. It's how we make decisions, and evaluate decisions. And I suspect that parts of our culture (twitter, talk radio, like-minded communities, information overload, inability to assess bias very well) creates a society that struggles to communicate effectively with people they disagree with. Even places like this forum, which is more polite and like-minded than most places, still has people trolling quite regularly. Hey, 10 years I loved the one-liners, too. But there's something about a growing lack of empathy that is a problem, and it's not going away.

To tie it back to TV's original comment, sure, Bush may have done some things causing direct harm (Iraq), and indirectly handled other bad situations poorly and made them worse (Katrina), but I don't think his presidency created a fundamental or permanent shift in national politics. Obama had more of an impact just on the discussion of what the government can do with respect to healthcare. Even if a Democrat wins in 2020, the damage of the Trump Presidency will last for a long time.

I don't disagree with anything werthless says, but tv, is right. The Iraq death and destruction alone, and the way it was arrived at, far outweigh anything the Donald has managed to this point. Though I suppose the abrogation of any responsibility in Syria and the Ukraine may eventually even the score a little bit. If it ever gets noticed, that is.

The Fake News Networks, those that knowingly have a sick and biased AGENDA, are worried about the competition and quality of Sinclair Broadcast. The “Fakers” at CNN, NBC, ABC & CBS have done so much dishonest reporting that they should only be allowed to get awards for fiction!

The big Caravan of People from Honduras, now coming across Mexico and heading to our “Weak Laws” Border, had better be stopped before it gets there. Cash cow NAFTA is in play, as is foreign aid to Honduras and the countries that allow this to happen. Congress MUST ACT NOW!

Check out the fact that you can’t get a job at ratings challenged @CNN unless you state that you are totally anti-Trump? Little Jeff Zuker, whose job is in jeopardy, is not having much fun lately. They should clean up and strengthen CNN and get back to honest reporting!

Thank you to Rasmussen for the honest polling. Just hit 50%, which is higher than Cheatin’ Obama at the same time in his Administration.

Warszawa wrote:Cheatin' Obama? Is that new?