You just spent the entire post speculating, then said it's pointless to speculate. Coulda saved me a lot of time there, wii

CFP wrote:You just spent the entire post speculating, then said it's pointless to speculate. Coulda saved me a lot of time there, wii

that was the point. came up with a bunch of speculations that all could be completely feasible to prove that there's no reason to speculate because we don't have enough data, and we as sports fans are wasting our time analyzing shit we don't know enough about.

good work title... kinda summed everything up there.

Titlehungry wrote:move on from Cesar... sorry wiiville...

oh trust me, i've wanted kingery at 2B and cesar in yankees pinstripes or mets blue+orange for as long as i can remember

I don’t think they were that overrated... if you projected them for 90 wins that was before Cutch and the whole bullpen got hurt.

I think the only thing that was really overrated was the back end of the rotation, and if Phillies fans overrated them so did a lot of national people with all the computer numbers projecting them as breakout candidates.

Was also pretty unlikely for basically everyone but Kingery to underperform at the plate

That's my biggest concern moving forward

Probably shouldn't have gone 6-7 vs. the Marlins this year either

MoBettle wrote:I don’t think they were that overrated... if you projected them for 90 wins that was before Cutch and the whole bullpen got hurt.

I think the only thing that was really overrated was the back end of the rotation, and if Phillies fans overrated them so did a lot of national people with all the computer numbers projecting them as breakout candidates.

I guess I meant more like myself and others like me overrating their chances as the season went on to right the ship because of initial expectations... I'll admit that up until a week or two ago, I kept thinking they are gonna go on a nice run and get back to the top of the division and be hot when the playoffs roll in and ready for a matchup with LA but that was never realistic with the bullpen injuries, lack of starting pitching, lack of hitting consistency, and odd managerial maneuvers... this current team as constructed with all the holes and injuries would have been solidly predicted as a 4th place team and that's probably where they will end up... hopefully next year is better

MoBettle wrote:I think the only thing that was really overrated was the back end of the rotation, and if Phillies fans overrated them so did a lot of national people with all the computer numbers projecting them as breakout candidates.

to be fair, they're all still young. including nola. but eflin/pivetta are super young. and eflin especially showed signs of dominance earlier in the year. IMO it's too early to just give up on them. but it's hard to keep trotting them out there when your team is otherwise wanting to win.

wiivile wrote:

MoBettle wrote:I think the only thing that was really overrated was the back end of the rotation, and if Phillies fans overrated them so did a lot of national people with all the computer numbers projecting them as breakout candidates.

to be fair, they're all still young. including nola. but eflin/pivetta are super young. and eflin especially showed signs of dominance earlier in the year. IMO it's too early to just give up on them. but it's hard to keep trotting them out there when your team is otherwise wanting to win.

Well they’ll all be 26-28 years old next year. It’s not impossible for any of them to still figure it out but it’s definitely getting late in the game.

McCutchen going down threw the lineup off kilter. We were so excited to have a consistent everyday lineup to start the year.

Stripes wrote:

The B1G Piece wrote:Cesar is player A and has been straight trash for over a year.

got our only hit last night

Not picking on you, but help me understand this logic.

- They send Franco down because they're tired of shit, which moves Kingery to a position that he cannot play. So we keep Kingery in the lineup everyday at the expense of Franco, only to play him out of position and just ignore the current 2B, the one position Kingery can really play, has been below average hitter over his last 800 PAs.
- Haseley is the odd man out at the expense of Roman Quinn, another below average hitter with little value other than his defense.
- We're going to play Jay Bruce and Corey Dickerson in the same outfield because we want their bats in the lineup at the same time

As others have said, it is so freaking obvious Kapler and crew value veterans with 'position' flexibility, but we will play most games during the rest of the season with two players out of position. It is mind-boggling mental gymnastics and we're a complete clown show right now.

I think management is counting on the DH being in the National League next season and wanting to let Bruce and Dickerson sample life in Philadelphia.

Nola hasn’t been very good this season either. Just sayin’.

JFLNYC wrote:Nola hasn’t been very good this season either. Just sayin’.

10-3 and 3.67 is very good

McCutchen, at least as far as the lineup, is a cop out. There was a regular on the roster who proved he can handle the lead-off spot. Cesar struggled after the broken foot last year but there's every reason to expect an OBP similar to what Cutch provided.

My impression is this staff uses sample sizes that are too small in their decision making.

Uncle Milty wrote:McCutchen, at least as far as the lineup, is a cop out. There was a regular on the roster who proved he can handle the lead-off spot. Cesar struggled after the broken foot last year but there's every reason to expect an OBP similar to what Cutch provided.

My impression is this staff uses sample sizes that are too small in their decision making.

Cesar has been disappointing too (on top of Herrera’s stuff and Franco being bad) but Cutch getting hurt sort of opened the flood gates in terms of guys that don’t belong in the majors like Williams and Quinn getting regular starts. Especially when guys like Bruce and Haseley got hurt themselves.

I guess it’s sort of a combination of everything though. If any of Cesar/Odubel/Franco have a career year or even just their best past season Cutch isn’t as big of a loss.

wiivile wrote:

JFLNYC wrote:Nola hasn’t been very good this season either. Just sayin’.

10-3 and 3.67 is very good

It's certainly not bad, but I wouldn't call it very good, especially for Nola. He's been inconsistent and should be better than this.

nola was awful in april and that's about it. he was unlucky if anything in june, but he's had a very good year minus the first month.

I haven't been a big Gabe supporter or detractor, but I'm fully on board with ditching him. Bring me Showalter. Hell, bring me Baker, just don't let him have Nola go more than 100 pitches.