Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby MoBettle » Wed Aug 07, 2019 17:02:45

Stripes wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:
The B1G Piece wrote:I'm officially 100 percent out on Kapler and whatever fucking group of nerds that trained him. The constant lack of feel for in game decisions, the mindless pitching changes and tinkering of the lineup to gain some sort of edge is infuriating.


Well put. I hadn't thought of it in these terms before but I agree. It almost seems sometimes he's trying to make some sort of contrarian point/be the smartest guy in the room rather than just using common sense.


Feels like a lot of decisions are made just to win that day's game, and not for the long haul. That's fine for the players to be focused just on that game, that AB, that pitch, but management has to look at the long view, know when to rest players so they're effective for the entire season, not burning thru the bullpen every night. You can't convince me that Kapler's bullpen usage hasn't at least contributed to some of the injuries, although it would be impossible to quantify. Of course, having half our current bullpen comprised of failed starters, who aren't available back-to-back nights, goes higher than Kapler. I remember last year, when he was managing the bullpen every game like it was the seventh game of the WS, people said he would burn out the pen by August. It took a bit longer than that, but here we are.

Of course literally allowing them to pitch contributes to the injuries but I don’t get how it’s that big of a contributor.

Robertson Hunter and Arano barely pitched, Seranthony pitched in 8 back to backs and Neshak pitched in 5. If that’s enough to make your arm fall off why isn’t every other bullpen suffering the same injuries as us?

People are acting like he’s riding all of these guys like they’re Johnny Venters and it’s just not the case.

And maybe he wouldn’t have to use as many relievers as he does if he didn’t have to deal with 4/5 starters barely going 5 innings if that all year.
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby Bucky » Wed Aug 07, 2019 17:04:31

does anyone track number of times warmed up in the bullpen?

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby azrider » Wed Aug 07, 2019 17:06:20

And the winner of today’s most condescending post goes to....

[Reveal] Spoiler:
ReadingPhilly wrote:the young/kranitz crying continues to baffle me.


Keep up the good work!

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby philliesphhan » Wed Aug 07, 2019 17:13:32

Stripes wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:
The B1G Piece wrote:I'm officially 100 percent out on Kapler and whatever fucking group of nerds that trained him. The constant lack of feel for in game decisions, the mindless pitching changes and tinkering of the lineup to gain some sort of edge is infuriating.


Well put. I hadn't thought of it in these terms before but I agree. It almost seems sometimes he's trying to make some sort of contrarian point/be the smartest guy in the room rather than just using common sense.


Feels like a lot of decisions are made just to win that day's game, and not for the long haul. That's fine for the players to be focused just on that game, that AB, that pitch, but management has to look at the long view, know when to rest players so they're effective for the entire season, not burning thru the bullpen every night. You can't convince me that Kapler's bullpen usage hasn't at least contributed to some of the injuries, although it would be impossible to quantify. Of course, having half our current bullpen comprised of failed starters, who aren't available back-to-back nights, goes higher than Kapler. I remember last year, when he was managing the bullpen every game like it was the seventh game of the WS, people said he would burn out the pen by August. It took a bit longer than that, but here we are.


Kruk literally said Bowa told him the opposite "worry about tomorrow tomorrow" so it's not like Gabe is unique in trying to win a single game. Also:

You can't convince me that Kapler's bullpen usage hasn't at least contributed to some of the injuries, although it would be impossible to quantify.


Pointed this out in another thread but the Phillies are basically dead center in terms of bullpen usage and actually a little lower (think it was 18th of 30 teams in innings)
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby BatFlipsFTW » Wed Aug 07, 2019 17:53:34

Stripes wrote:
JFLNYC wrote:
The B1G Piece wrote:I'm officially 100 percent out on Kapler and whatever #$!&@ group of nerds that trained him. The constant lack of feel for in game decisions, the mindless pitching changes and tinkering of the lineup to gain some sort of edge is infuriating.


Well put. I hadn't thought of it in these terms before but I agree. It almost seems sometimes he's trying to make some sort of contrarian point/be the smartest guy in the room rather than just using common sense.


Feels like a lot of decisions are made just to win that day's game, and not for the long haul. That's fine for the players to be focused just on that game, that AB, that pitch, but management has to look at the long view, know when to rest players so they're effective for the entire season, not burning thru the bullpen every night. You can't convince me that Kapler's bullpen usage hasn't at least contributed to some of the injuries, although it would be impossible to quantify. Of course, having half our current bullpen comprised of failed starters, who aren't available back-to-back nights, goes higher than Kapler. I remember last year, when he was managing the bullpen every game like it was the seventh game of the WS, people said he would burn out the pen by August. It took a bit longer than that, but here we are.


People piss and moan if he takes the long view approach too.
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby bleh » Wed Aug 07, 2019 18:06:02

The team is completely different from even 2 weeks ago. They added Smyly, Dickerson & Vargas. All of them have been good. Franco and his .700 OPS is gone. Quinn is playing like Trout. Velasquez has been good lately. The team is 10-7. There's lots of stuff to be optimistic about. But people just like to wig out over every loss.

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby mtcal » Wed Aug 07, 2019 22:19:46

The B1G Piece wrote:
bleh wrote:
Monkeyboy wrote:

I'd feel differently if he didn't tinker the lineup and bullpen to death like he did last year and they were 10 games under .500 after June 1st last season. And, even more so if the front office didn't feed Bob Nightengale a story today that they love him.


to play devil's advocate he's had to figure out a lineup without having a real leadoff hitter on the team since cutch went down,
plus it's obvious that nothing has worked for an extended time as they haven't had any significant winning streaks or even hot streaks really or even times they've scored a lot of runs in a lot of games in a row i don't think.

from the pen perspective likewise he's tinkered there a good part because of all the injuries, then all the guys who haven't been effective regularly, then having to put starters in there because a> they can't start and b> there's nowhere else to put them and c> there's no one else to fill in
Not everything I think is something I should say.

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby WhiteyFan » Thu Aug 08, 2019 09:20:31

Managers get too much credit when they win and too much criticism when they lose.

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby thephan » Thu Aug 08, 2019 09:58:05

bleh wrote:The team is completely different from even 2 weeks ago. They added Smyly, Dickerson & Vargas. All of them have been good. Franco and his .700 OPS is gone. Quinn is playing like Trout. Velasquez has been good lately. The team is 10-7. There's lots of stuff to be optimistic about. But people just like to wig out over every loss.


Its the binary nature of the losses being so disproportionate to the wins. When you lose by like 4 or more runs regularly it is easy to be really dower. Smyly and Vargas are hardly answers long term based on their stats. Jake giving his maximum effort with hopes of cracking the 5th inning is also super depressing.
yawn

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby thephan » Thu Aug 08, 2019 09:59:25

WhiteyFan wrote:Managers get too much credit when they win and too much criticism when they lose.



Waddabout when they just do random things that defy logic and convention netting the predictably horrible outcomes?
yawn

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby stevelxa476 » Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:00:41

thephan wrote:
WhiteyFan wrote:Managers get too much credit when they win and too much criticism when they lose.



Waddabout when they just do random things that defy logic and convention netting the predictably horrible outcomes?


The only thing I know about strategy is that everything the manager does is crap. Unless it works, in which case he's a button pusher.
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby BatFlipsFTW » Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:12:37

thephan wrote:
WhiteyFan wrote:Managers get too much credit when they win and too much criticism when they lose.



Waddabout when they just do random things that defy logic and convention netting the predictably horrible outcomes?


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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby kruker » Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:12:45

thephan wrote:
bleh wrote:The team is completely different from even 2 weeks ago. They added Smyly, Dickerson & Vargas. All of them have been good. Franco and his .700 OPS is gone. Quinn is playing like Trout. Velasquez has been good lately. The team is 10-7. There's lots of stuff to be optimistic about. But people just like to wig out over every loss.


Its the binary nature of the losses being so disproportionate to the wins. When you lose by like 4 or more runs regularly it is easy to be really dower. Smyly and Vargas are hardly answers long term based on their stats. Jake giving his maximum effort with hopes of cracking the 5th inning is also super depressing.


This. It also makes you wonder how good this team is. If you put any credence in Pythagorean records, we've actually been lucky this year. Granted, I agree this team is much different now from what it was, so looking at full season stats isn't totally appropriate. That said our negative run differential can be totally accounted for since the all star break.
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby The B1G Piece » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:04:17

Hoskins on pace for lowest HR% of his career; Harper on pace for lowest since 2014.

Also, team has the 3rd lowest SLG% in the NL since the ASB.

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby JFLNYC » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:26:47

Obviously having trouble with deciding between A swings and B swings.
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby Slowhand » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:27:08

Hoskins only has one full major league season under his belt, so I’m not sure how telling that is. He’s just about surpassed his walk total from last season in about 150 or so fewer PAs, and his overall numbers are still really good. Bryce, on the other hand, is disappointing.
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby The B1G Piece » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:37:17

Slowhand wrote:Hoskins only has one full major league season under his belt, so I’m not sure how telling that is. He’s just about surpassed his walk total from last season in about 150 or so fewer PAs, and his overall numbers are still really good. Bryce, on the other hand, is disappointing.

Yeah, the Harper stuff isn't great and with Hoskins, I agree his overall numbers are very good. However, I don't like our two biggest power hitters declining HR-rates in a record setting HR year.

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby wiivile » Thu Aug 08, 2019 13:30:02

can anyone make out what cesar said in this video? https://streamable.com/yfem2

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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby Uncle Milty » Thu Aug 08, 2019 13:34:17

wiivile wrote:can anyone make out what cesar said in this video? https://streamable.com/yfem2


wee-evil, stop talking about us on back she goes
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Re: Phillies 2019 Discussion III: The Dog Days of Bummer

Postby BigEd76 » Thu Aug 08, 2019 13:39:13

"dos more month then Scott take over"

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