dajafi wrote:The thing I don't understand is why Boehner, who's clearly not an ideologue, keeps yielding to these psychos.

Phan In Phlorida wrote:

dajafi wrote:The thing I don't understand is why Boehner, who's clearly not an ideologue, keeps yielding to these psychos.

The Koch brothers.

The Kochs fund much of the Tea Party through their political groups (Americans for Prosperity, FreedomWorks, various PACs, etc.). Boehner is a weak Speaker because, while he needs the TP'ers, they don't need him. They don't need to be beholden to Boehner since they don't need RNC monies, they get their monies from the Kochs.

One thing that's gotten lost in the debate over the shutdown is how much Democrats have already conceded to Republicans on spending. This is partly the consequence of the direct spending cuts in the 2011 debt-ceiling deal and partly the consequence of sequestration (which was, of course, also part of the 2011 deal). Still, the bottom line is that Republicans have been so successful at making Obamacare concessions the issue that Democratic concessions on spending have gone almost unnoticed.

Due to the temporary shutdown of the federal government, the Library of Congress is closed to the public and researchers beginning October 1, 2013 until further notice.

td11 wrote:

One thing that's gotten lost in the debate over the shutdown is how much Democrats have already conceded to Republicans on spending. This is partly the consequence of the direct spending cuts in the 2011 debt-ceiling deal and partly the consequence of sequestration (which was, of course, also part of the 2011 deal). Still, the bottom line is that Republicans have been so successful at making Obamacare concessions the issue that Democratic concessions on spending have gone almost unnoticed.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/won ... one-graph/

momadance wrote:Our Zumba class here is canceled. Seriously.

swishnicholson wrote:

td11 wrote:

One thing that's gotten lost in the debate over the shutdown is how much Democrats have already conceded to Republicans on spending. This is partly the consequence of the direct spending cuts in the 2011 debt-ceiling deal and partly the consequence of sequestration (which was, of course, also part of the 2011 deal). Still, the bottom line is that Republicans have been so successful at making Obamacare concessions the issue that Democratic concessions on spending have gone almost unnoticed.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/won ... one-graph/

While one can believe there will be long-term negative consequences for the Republican party, it is pretty remarkable how badly they've outmaneuvered the Democrats in framing discussion . From the near universal adoption of the term "Obamacare" to the current public discussion being limited to how "The Government" is failing to compromise they've shown an ability to demonize the Affordable Care Act as a federal takeover (and minimize its seemingly innocuous goal of providing medical insurance to more people) pretty much the entire issue is being discussed on their terms. And I don't blame them for that, just wonder why the Democratic response has been so splintered and unclear.

swishnicholson wrote:

momadance wrote:Our Zumba class here is canceled. Seriously.

FFS, whatever happened to the idea of essential personnel?

swishnicholson wrote:just wonder why the Democratic response has been so splintered and unclear.

danrosz wrote:Being out of work sucks... Going to dip into the Andy Reid archives and watch some of his classics to cheer me up.

td11 wrote:

swishnicholson wrote:

td11 wrote:

One thing that's gotten lost in the debate over the shutdown is how much Democrats have already conceded to Republicans on spending. This is partly the consequence of the direct spending cuts in the 2011 debt-ceiling deal and partly the consequence of sequestration (which was, of course, also part of the 2011 deal). Still, the bottom line is that Republicans have been so successful at making Obamacare concessions the issue that Democratic concessions on spending have gone almost unnoticed.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/won ... one-graph/

While one can believe there will be long-term negative consequences for the Republican party, it is pretty remarkable how badly they've outmaneuvered the Democrats in framing discussion . From the near universal adoption of the term "Obamacare" to the current public discussion being limited to how "The Government" is failing to compromise they've shown an ability to demonize the Affordable Care Act as a federal takeover (and minimize its seemingly innocuous goal of providing medical insurance to more people) pretty much the entire issue is being discussed on their terms. And I don't blame them for that, just wonder why the Democratic response has been so splintered and unclear.

and yet, despite their absurd attempts to portray the ACA as something that is terrible for the american people, that it is "the biggest job killer of all," and misrepresenting polls to claim that they are only doing the peoples' will, the president won re-election and the ACA withstood judicial review in the SC. dems even got a greater % of the overall vote in the house.

i think the media plays a great part in framing the discussion, too, and for all the talk of liberal media bias, the general public still thinks "both sides are to blame" when obama has basically had to preside through historically obstructionist, uncompromising, and legislatively unproductive congresses for his entire tenure

Phan In Phlorida wrote:Today is NASA's 55th birthday. There's no one there to celebrate.

Phan In Phlorida wrote:

dajafi wrote:The thing I don't understand is why Boehner, who's clearly not an ideologue, keeps yielding to these psychos.

The Koch brothers.

The Kochs fund much of the Tea Party through their political groups (Americans for Prosperity, FreedomWorks, various PACs, etc.). Boehner is a weak Speaker because, while he needs the TP'ers, they don't need him. They don't need to be beholden to Boehner since they don't need RNC monies, they get their monies from the Kochs.

dajafi wrote:

Phan In Phlorida wrote:

dajafi wrote:The thing I don't understand is why Boehner, who's clearly not an ideologue, keeps yielding to these psychos.

The Koch brothers.

The Kochs fund much of the Tea Party through their political groups (Americans for Prosperity, FreedomWorks, various PACs, etc.). Boehner is a weak Speaker because, while he needs the TP'ers, they don't need him. They don't need to be beholden to Boehner since they don't need RNC monies, they get their monies from the Kochs.

All true. But I (think I) meant why he cares so much to keep his miserable, thankless job in the first place.

Any legislative leader is going to be hated. To the guys in the other jerseys, you're the embodiment of evil. To those on your team, you're a gutless if not treasonous sellout forever snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. It's bad enough for Reid and Pelosi, and the Dems don't even totally disdain the idea of compromise. McConnell is having an awful time of it, and I think he's more of a deep down shitty human being than Boehner--who really just wants to golf, smoke, drink and feel like a big shot.