Bucky wrote:I think we're sort of at the root of the philosophical differences. People who rely on religious beliefs to set their values feel that their beliefs intrinsically can't be bigoted because those are the beliefs of a widely practiced theology.

Doll Is Mine wrote: Unless you're a parent holding your child's hand in the street, what exactly is the purpose?

Werthless wrote:

Bucky wrote:I think we're sort of at the root of the philosophical differences. People who rely on religious beliefs to set their values feel that their beliefs intrinsically can't be bigoted because those are the beliefs of a widely practiced theology.

I'm definitely reconsidering my thinking... I'll have to give it more thought. I'm not a lawyer, but there are certain protected classes on which a government/employer/etc cant discriminate. The law probably needs to catch up, but there's a reason that certain characteristics are not protected classes.

Maybe because I'm not gay and I can get married, but I view marriage as less of a human rights issue than something like the death penalty or abortion. And on these issues, I think many would disagree with calling your opponent bigots by virtue of their position. And if you (collectively) wouldn't call someone a bigot for supporting certain kinds of murder, then how can you call someone a bigot for something as trivial as gay marriage? Is someone who supports the death penalty a bigot who wants to play God with people's lives? Is a person a bigot who won't protect the life of fetuses 14 weeks old? I think it's a huge stretch, and cheapens the word for people who truly deserve to be called it.

(Sorry for the jarbled post)

CalvinBall wrote:trivial as gay marriage

Doll Is Mine wrote:Unless you're a parent holding your child's hand in the street, what exactly is the purpose?

RichmondPhilsFan wrote:

Werthless wrote:If you define a person's position (Instead of the federal government, states should decide who can do _______) as bigotry requires a large leap. Classifying your political opponents as bigots/asshat/jerks is exactly the definition of bigotry, which amused me. Again, I'm pro gay marriage, but not every person that opposes me is a bigot. And nothing about Ryan's statement suggested hatred or animosity. Understand?

Please. They're pushing to defend DOMA (which so far has proved to be 100% indefensible) and have openly supported a gay marriage ban being inserted into the U.S. Constitution. The Federalism argument is pretextual nonsense. They don't want to leave it to the states at all.

Werthless wrote:

Bucky wrote:I think we're sort of at the root of the philosophical differences. People who rely on religious beliefs to set their values feel that their beliefs intrinsically can't be bigoted because those are the beliefs of a widely practiced theology.

I'm definitely reconsidering my thinking... I'll have to give it more thought. I'm not a lawyer, but there are certain protected classes on which a government/employer/etc cant discriminate. The law probably needs to catch up, but there's a reason that certain characteristics are not protected classes.

Maybe because I'm not gay and I can get married, but I view marriage as less of a human rights issue than something like the death penalty or abortion. And on these issues, I think many would disagree with calling your opponent bigots by virtue of their position. And if you (collectively) wouldn't call someone a bigot for supporting certain kinds of murder, then how can you call someone a bigot for something as trivial as gay marriage? Is someone who supports the death penalty a bigot who wants to play God with people's lives? Is a person a bigot who won't protect the life of fetuses 14 weeks old? I think it's a huge stretch, and cheapens the word for people who truly deserve to be called it.

(Sorry for the jarbled post)

td11 wrote:denying people basic rights based on your own religious doctrine is pretty hateful, imo

Aziz Ansari ‏@azizansari

"Sorry officer, no ticket for me, if I'm over the speed limit, that's something God intended. Peace."