How do you know if that biker didnt spit on someone or throw something at someone before he got to that point. Their is not enough evidence in that video to presume their was or wasnt probable cause.

Philly the Kid wrote:

mpmcgraw wrote:Like seriously your other conspiracy theories were just so stupid they were insulting our intelligence, but that post is just $#@! insulting in general.

To be quite honest I doubt you have regular social contact with anyone except maybe your mom in real life if you truly believe that to be true.

You really think that? Whatever you think of my political and social views, you think that the guy whose posts you've been reading here, has a style and content that makes him some kind of nut-job social outcast? You are incompetent then, to even make such a projection. How old are you son? 22? younger? Have you finished high school? You need to calm down the hysteria, and name calling -- and learn how to think and write.

I'm insulting your intelligence by showing a YouTube that 1million have seen of a neanderthal cop indscriminately knocking a bicyclist off his bike for no reason other than he thought he could get away with it. You think people like that should carry a side arm and a badge and be afforded respect. What are you taking about? Get an education. And wake up to the way the world really is.

Yes, I'd bet a large amount of money that you are a social outcast. Everything we know about you points to you being a social outcast.

No, your 9/11 conspiracy theory insults my intelligence, your generalization about cops is insulting because generalizations about any group of people is no worse than racism. It also helps that your conspiracy theory(or altered reality or whatever you want to call it) this time involves people that most people have relationships with in real life so it is insulting on another level.

I can only pray that one day the man in the white jumpsuit and butterfly net catches up with you.

Mcgraw has an all out coherent and vicious side that I would not have expected.

Philly the Kid wrote:

Houshphandzadeh wrote:I don't think that video gives you enough information to draw a conclusion.

really?? seriously...?!

wow...

Cause for an investigation, yeah, but I have no idea what transpired before or after the video.

Philly the Kid wrote:

Houshphandzadeh wrote:I don't think that video gives you enough information to draw a conclusion.

really?? seriously...?!

wow...

This shows two interesting perspectives. ptk favors a "whatever interpretation confirms my beliefs is true" perspective. Houshphandzadeh favors an "I'll make up my mind after I get all the information" perspective. They may both arrive at the same conclusion but take different routes. I favor Houshphandzadeh's view. This is certainly something which should be investigated. Anyone here is innocent until proven guilty. Did the rider do something before the video to warrant being stopped? Did the officer order him to stop and he failed to comply?

I can't imagine that there wasn't some reason that guy got taken out like that. I mean, I'm rather distrustful of cops, but I'd find it pretty hard to believe that a cop "randomly" decided to take out some biker--in front of hundreds of people, mind you--just because he wanted to. I mean, I guess, but I'd have my money on the guy having done something to warrant it.

After saying that he wanted to do joint town halls in May and June the Obama campaign has elected not do so. David Plouffe had been pushing for it. He's been replaced by Rahm Emanuel.

After Friday's awkward town hall, Obama is smart in doing so. In town halls he often fumbles and is awkward with his answers. He may be too thoughtful for such a venue. People are looking for simple answers to their questions. Obama's "gaffes" occur more often in town halls.

Obama has also decided to limit Presidential debates to three. I don't think either candidate has an advantage in a debate. Neither is exceptional or awful. I'm not sure why Obama's people only want three and McCain's people want more.

Obama's foreign trip took him away from talking about the economy and instead addressing foreign policy. I think this is a mistake. Obama isn't going to win by convincing Americans of his bonafides on foreign policy. He'll win by stressing the economy and other domestic issues.

As long as his campaign keeps up with the idea that experience doesn't matter, they'll be running in the mud. No one believes that. When they talk about foreign policy, they can say that experience is helpful but that a fresh approach is needed. Obama has to stop running away from his inexperience and reframe that his lack of experience is why he should be elected. He doesn't give his outsider status enough emphasis.

Obama spent a lot of time hammering on McCain and going negative with the Bush link. He seems to have goaded McCain into going negative and misrepresenting what happened. This is a huge advantage to Obama. Hammering at McCain's image of honesty and straightforwardness has only made the Obama campaign look like whiners. They needed McCain to destroy the image himself. You can't beat the other guy's strength. He has to do it.

I think that's what McCain is missing with the emphasis on Obama's popularity and arrogance. Maybe he has a point, but by complaining about it they destroy their point. They just look bitter.

Obama is smart to point out that if McCain is only talking about him, what is he offering? Unfortunately he goes too far and stresses himself as a victim way too much. Saying you didn't play the race card just perpetuates the idea you did. It seems that both of the candidates want to not only lead the horse to water, but also make him drink. They have to let the public figure these things out for themselves.

The less McCain talks the better for him. I don't see how anyone can disagree with that.

He messes up when it is a prepared debat and he messes up when it is off the cuff comments. The best thing he can do is talk as little as possible.

Slowhand wrote:I can't imagine that there wasn't some reason that guy got taken out like that. I mean, I'm rather distrustful of cops, but I'd find it pretty hard to believe that a cop "randomly" decided to take out some biker--in front of hundreds of people, mind you--just because he wanted to. I mean, I guess, but I'd have my money on the guy having done something to warrant it.

And that's a big difference between me and many who post here in this thread. To me there was enough advance footage of the bicyclist to see he surely couldn't have done anything more than utter some words. To me, there was plenty to seein that video. The guy was clearly trying to veer to the left of the cop, and if the cop had an issue with him, he could have simply grabbed the bike or stood in front of him with his hands up to stop. He got a running start and pummeled him. Theguy played football in Long Island where he grew up at least at the high school level. You can all say that a lot more info isneeded, but I don't. Unless the kid had shot someone and put the gun back in his pocket both his hands were on the steering so he didn't DO anything. If you think he did smoething prior to that scene, if it was that bad, then why was only the one cop even paying attention.

See, you see that (some of you) and htink, no way he does that without SOME reason. I think just the opposite. That many manypeople that become law enforcement, military, prison guards -- and other positions of control and authority with weapons, are people not qualified at all to be out there. I think those jobs more than any in society should require the highest IQs, training education. Police shoudl now history, politics and be able to navigate complex situations. I think there are a lot of out-of-control guys. I really didn't want to start up the Cops debate again. We've done this dance in another threadabout Philly cops and others... there evidence is clear to me that MANY cops are out of control and criminal themsleves at minimum in their abuses of their badge. I heard a report that I linked to I think earlier on Friday about lots of footage coming out after 00 and 04 Rep conventions showing cops totally lying. There was a case in Philly where the cop had a sworn affadavit about facts about a so-called criminal biker protester whatever and it was proven theguy was completely miles away in another part of town. This stuff is an epidemic in my opinion.

Im' really startled that most of or some ofyou, really don't find this video fairly clear and straightforward. He could have called the cop any name in the book and he shouldn't be assaulted like that. That is abuse of power.

See Lax, while I have no easy way to deliver to you a lifetime of evidence to demonstrate how I've reached some of the opinions I have, opinions that remain open to reformation -- but the cumulative things I feel I've learned have gotten me to a place. I'm not uncritical in my analysis, or just jump on anyhting, but I am mistrustful of govt authority and the system that protects itself. I believe most cops lie all the time, and particularly in this area around protestors, people they see as "radical" "other" "hippie", "renegade" find a term that means, "other" to a cop and they then feel they can do anything to them. And now, with the definition of "terrorist" expanding, anyone protesting soon will be a posisble "terrorist". If you all can't see the trend what has occured in the last 8 year, then I don't know what to say...

This incident may prove to have some other bits to it, but there's nothing short of this guyjust shooting someone that woudl excuse a takedown like that.

I'm sure you can all find lots of articles out there about this case... see what you find.

Its interesting how most of the police and other abuses are against protestors orpeople of color or poor people. Few of which anyone on this board is... so how you form your opinion on what norms are out there, is not in the trenches of where a lot of this happens.

Anyway... there's a Phils game to keep an eye on... 'nuff of this...

They were targeting that particular guy for some reason or another. As soon as both cops made him, they started toward him. I bet - almost guarantee- something happened up the road. Cops have radios, ya know.

Not saying it was right. Just that there's a lot more to this incident than is on the video.

Ask 1- you can make a video tell a certain story if you edit it just right.

PTK - doesn't it seem funny that you seek unreasonably complicated explanations in some cases, and yet absolutely refuse to consider what amounts to the tiniest sliver of an off-screen explanation (in comparison) to an event you demand be taken at face value?

9/11? Most recorded event in human history = NOT TO BE TAKEN AT FACE VALUE

Guy on bike YouTube = WE SEE EVERYTHING WE NEED TO ITS OBVIOUS COPS ARE EVIL

It's weird, dude. I don't even think anyone is arguing that there aren't bad cops - it's just. Weird.

You know, Vox...that's a very good point.

I don't know Vox. How many people have epistemic biases? I mean, we tend to see the political world through ideological lenses, and we adjust our non-political theories to suit those biases. It's like the whole activist judge nonsense. People want judges who are pro-choice or pro-life. No one really cares about judicial philosophy.

(mostly) nonsense.

He seems to have goaded McCain into going negative

LoLz

Well. I go away for one weekend and this thread goes even more guano.

Philly the Kid wrote:

philliesphhan wrote:

Philly the Kid wrote:[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUkiyBVytRQ&feature=related[/youtube]

The victim is still under arrest -- for assaulting a police officer. The cop a former football player.

Why'd he knock him off his bike?

Because cops are messed up? This was critical mass, and while I'm not a big bicycle activist, this kind of thing goes on all the time. I'm not in the mood to get started on anoher big controversy, but the old adage about cops. "most are good guys, just a couple bad apples..." sorry -- I believe pretty much the opposite. And the culture evenmoreso than ever has cops feeling they can do whatever and lie about it in affadavits. The project in NYC still dealing with the 04 Rep convention has revealed 100's if not 1000's of bogus cop reports and worse...

As of last week, this guy on the bike had charges AGAINST HIM and the cop was on desk duty. The might make an example of him, but most of this stuff isn't on vdieo on you tube... sadly....

I would have accepted "I don't know" as an answer.

dajafi wrote:Critical Mass just might be the single dumbest $#@! thing in the world.

C'mon. Critical Mass (by Nuclear Assault) is an OK song.

pacino wrote:

He seems to have goaded McCain into going negative

LoLz

Obama's campaign strategy stresses three things, hope, change, and that McCain is another four years of Bush. He could have gone negative on McCain's policies or character but instead took it a step further and went after Bush. Lumping someone in with an unpopular President is going negative. His strategy wasn't "Bush is good. So vote for McCain." And it worked for him. McCain wasn't getting much media attention or voter attention until he went negative.

mpmcgraw, you probably haven't seen McCain work a room in a town hall format. While Obama has an amazing ability to connect with people through a speech, McCain can connect with a room by going one on one.