Kamala is live on CNN. Asked if Joe will avoid any future debates, she says "Joe will never avoid an opportunity to talk to the public". Currently addressing the race stuff from the debate

Wolfgang622 wrote:Even Santorum is on Trump.

Ewwww

Stand down and stand by was clearly a slogan they worked on before tonight. He’s too dumb to have come up with that on the fly.

They anticipated that question and that was the prepared answer.

Most shameful moment of the night and frankly my life as an American.

JFLNYC wrote:

jerseyhoya wrote:The only thing that could have moved the needle tonight was Biden having a very bad senior moment. He apparently didn't.

Everything else is noise.

Trump is losing by a pretty fair margin today. Seems like that is unlikely to change.

Agreed. I ask myself 3 questions:

1. Did any Trump supporter watching tonight decide to vote for Biden?

2. Did any Biden supporter decide to vote for Trump?

3. Is any undecided enthused about voting for either of them?

I’m pretty sure the answer to all 3 questions is “no.” It was simply a debasement of our country for no apparent purpose.

Pretty much. Wallace hates Trump but he did let him do his rants way too much. Maybe on purpose. The clown thing was mild I thought. I was expecting Trump to start calling him names but amazingly he didn't.

thephan wrote:Put them in boxes where they can turn off the mics when it's not their turn.

Put trump in one of those big cylinders that blow money around. He won't say a word word all night.

I felt like Trump would get two minutes, then Biden would get 2 minutes with Trump talking over him, then Trump would get another minute and Biden would get nothing. Trump even got extra time at the end to rail about Hunter some more. I'd be interested to see what the final time totals were, including a breakdown of how much time they were talking when it was the other person's turn. Maybe my mind is skewed due to how much I wanted to punch Trump in the head.

Next time, if Trump comes out like this again, which I would have to assume he will, I hope Biden, rather than calling names like "clown" or "worst president ever," just gets coached at a particular chosen moment, probably while COVID is being discussed, to simply call attention to the behavior and situation itself, and say something like:

"Folks, let's just stop a minute. What we need right now is a leader, someone who can be calm, clear, level-headed, someone who can inspire these qualities in others. Look at our President right now. He knows he's behind in the polls, he knows it's getting close to the election, and he is panicked and desperate. And how do we know? Because he's behaving as panicked and desperate people do: he is unable to concentrate on one topic at a time; he interrupts constantly; he talks a lot but fails to put a coherent thought together. We can't have a panicked, easily rattled megalomaniac as our president, and especially not now, when so much needs calm, level-headed, quick but measured planning and doing. We can't have this."

As Augustus said, he did fine, but room for improvement. I don't know that any needles get moved no matter what he said, but if the 1980 debate was about the American people just checking into make sure Reagan wasn't an unhinged lunatic before handing him the keys, this is that idea on methamphetamines laced with cocaine and ecstasy.

Grittys grit wrote:

thephan wrote:Put them in boxes where they can turn off the mics when it's not their turn.

Put trump in one of those big cylinders that blow money around. He won't say a word word all night.

lol

Wolfgang622 wrote:Next time, if Trump comes out like this again, which I will have to assume he will, I hope Biden, rather than calling names like "clown" or "worst president ever," just gets coached at a particular chosen moment, probably while COVID is being discussed, and simply call attention to the behavior and situation itself, say something like:

"Folks, let's just stop a minute. What we need right now is a leader, someone who can be calm, clear, level-headed, someone who can inspire these qualities in others. Look at our President right now. He knows he's behind in the polls, he knows it's getting close to the election, and he is panicked and desperate. And how do we know? Because he's behaving as panicked and desperate people do: he is unable to concentrate on one topic at a time; he interrupts constantly; he talks a lot but fails to put a coherent thought together. We can't have a panicked, easily rattled megalomaniac as our president, and especially not now, when so much needs calm, level-headed, quick but measured planning and doing. We can't have this."

As Augustus said, he did fine, but room for improvement. I don't know that any needles get moved no matter what he said, but if the 1980 debate was about the American people just checking into make sure Reagan wasn't an unhinged lunatic before handing him the keys, this is that idea on methamphetamines laced with cocaine and ecstasy.

There are seven complete sentences in that response, what makes you think he would get through one of them interrupted?

mcare89 wrote:

Wolfgang622 wrote:Next time, if Trump comes out like this again, which I will have to assume he will, I hope Biden, rather than calling names like "clown" or "worst president ever," just gets coached at a particular chosen moment, probably while COVID is being discussed, and simply call attention to the behavior and situation itself, say something like:

"Folks, let's just stop a minute. What we need right now is a leader, someone who can be calm, clear, level-headed, someone who can inspire these qualities in others. Look at our President right now. He knows he's behind in the polls, he knows it's getting close to the election, and he is panicked and desperate. And how do we know? Because he's behaving as panicked and desperate people do: he is unable to concentrate on one topic at a time; he interrupts constantly; he talks a lot but fails to put a coherent thought together. We can't have a panicked, easily rattled megalomaniac as our president, and especially not now, when so much needs calm, level-headed, quick but measured planning and doing. We can't have this."

As Augustus said, he did fine, but room for improvement. I don't know that any needles get moved no matter what he said, but if the 1980 debate was about the American people just checking into make sure Reagan wasn't an unhinged lunatic before handing him the keys, this is that idea on methamphetamines laced with cocaine and ecstasy.

There are seven complete sentences in that response, what makes you think he would get through one of them interrupted?

Well rehearsed, those interruptions could be used to prove the point, and would of course drive Trump to even crazier heights than tonight.

In my view, the proud boys moment needs to be highlighted. I also think it was an example of Wallace’s pro Trump bias that the fact that Trump sucks at business didn’t really come up.

Who won tonight's debate? CBS News poll

Biden 48% (+7)
Trump 41%

Wolfgang622 wrote:Next time, if Trump comes out like this again, which I will have to assume he will, I hope Biden, rather than calling names like "clown" or "worst president ever," just gets coached at a particular chosen moment, probably while COVID is being discussed, and simply call attention to the behavior and situation itself, say something like:

"Folks, let's just stop a minute. What we need right now is a leader, someone who can be calm, clear, level-headed, someone who can inspire these qualities in others. Look at our President right now. He knows he's behind in the polls, he knows it's getting close to the election, and he is panicked and desperate. And how do we know? Because he's behaving as panicked and desperate people do: he is unable to concentrate on one topic at a time; he interrupts constantly; he talks a lot but fails to put a coherent thought together. We can't have a panicked, easily rattled megalomaniac as our president, and especially not now, when so much needs calm, level-headed, quick but measured planning and doing. We can't have this."
.

Yeh, this is similar to what I was saying about the grievance stuff. Make Trump and the viewers very aware of his behavior. He might stop the behavior, which is good for Biden, or if he doesn't the viewers just might think, "Holy cow, he IS doing that and he can't stop himself." The only difference is I suggested Biden do it in the initial few minutes to stave off the craziness before it starts. Trump can only be one person.... he has little filter. Show the public who that person is.

Anyway, I was happy with Biden's performance. I'd like to see him do a better job hitting some of the obvious holes in Trump's logic as there were some big openings Biden didn't walk through, but he held serve and looked far more presidential, so those wanting a return to normal will feel fine with Biden. I'd also prefer Biden hit him hard, but not through silly swipes half under his breath. If he wants to call him a fool/clown, call him a fool/clown, but do it in the confines of the debate questions, rather than annoyed stabs during transitions, etc.

threecount wrote:Who won tonight's debate? CBS News poll

Biden 48% (+7)
Trump 41%

Pretty much the exact numbers 538 is showing right now nationally. These debates will be the Rorschach tests of our time.

threecount wrote:Who won tonight's debate? CBS News poll

Biden 48% (+7)
Trump 41%

Well I’d like to be encouraged by that but polling after Hillary and Trump’s first tussle indicated Hillary won showed a MUCH bigger margin for her. CNN had one where she won 62-27, like unheard of difference.

CNN Poll who won debate Biden 60
Trump 28

Disastrous night for both in my opinion.

Trump's a complete mess. He had a couple potential strong points actually relating to policy and totally blew his chance to get them to land. Bullies tend to be bullies because they are scared their weaknesses will show through, and that's Trump to the capital T. His lack of confidence makes him look awful in that setting. I think the COVID issue is where he had potential to score points...he started to plant a seed of thought that liberal policies could have led to a death total of greater than 200k...and he started to touch on the very real psychological issues the young are facing from their social/athletic/artistic outlets (which for many of them equates to their identities) being shut down. He had one clear opening there to display humanity but he simply couldn't close either point because of his constant need to turn everything into an attempt to belittle Biden.

However, Biden came across as the clear beta on the stage. The only time I saw a real zest for leadership was when he defended his son, but Trump rather effectively countered that by getting Biden to stumble when identifying which son he was defending, then wandering off on an apparent realization he should probably take the chance to defend both. Biden was too soft, too whiny and didn't rise above like we were promised. Understandable based on the total onslaught he was facing, but somehow he has to have the confidence his points will stand on their own and he doesn't need to stop in the middle of his statements to respond to Trump's interruptions. His strongest moments were looking at the camera on a few occasions, but he was cliche in those statements and I don't know if they'll resonate. The look was very good when he did it (and it was a level of humanity Trump predictably couldn't stoop to), so it might be what most point to as giving either of them a clear advantage on the night.

History raises all sorts of red flags about whether or not general election polls have a ton of merit, but if they do I'd imagine Biden is sitting a slight touch prettier than before the night started. He missed a chance to do even better, but I can't see Trump's performance causing many undecided or swing voters to move his direction. If he's truly ~10 points behind, he needs to do something different than what he showed tonight.

Ultimately, we learned tonight the best this sad political system has to offer us in 2020 is a couple too old, too rich, too white and too angry men who have years of poor decision making behind and seemingly ahead of them. Sad night.

threecount wrote:CNN Poll who won debate Biden 60
Trump 28

I heard of something like that once.

LastTrain wrote:Disastrous night for both in my opinion.

Trump's a complete mess. He had a couple potential strong points actually relating to policy and totally blew his chance to get them to land. Bullies tend to be bullies because they are scared their weaknesses will show through, and that's Trump to the capital T. His lack of confidence makes him look awful in that setting. I think the COVID issue is where he had potential to score points...he started to plant a seed of thought that liberal policies could have led to a death total of greater than 200k...and he started to touch on the very real psychological issues the young are facing from their social/athletic/artistic outlets (which for many of them equates to their identities) being shut down. He had one clear opening there to display humanity but he simply couldn't close either point because of his constant need to turn everything into an attempt to belittle Biden.

However, Biden came across as the clear beta on the stage. The only time I saw a real zest for leadership was when he defended his son, but Trump rather effectively countered that by getting Biden to stumble when identifying which son he was defending, then wandering off on an apparent realization he should probably take the chance to defend both. Biden was too soft, too whiny and didn't rise above like we were promised. Understandable based on the total onslaught he was facing, but somehow he has to have the confidence his points will stand on their own and he doesn't need to stop in the middle of his statements to respond to Trump's interruptions. His strongest moments were looking at the camera on a few occasions, but he was cliche in those statements and I don't know if they'll resonate. The look was very good when he did it (and it was a level of humanity Trump predictably couldn't stoop to), so it might be what most point to as giving either of them a clear advantage on the night.

History raises all sorts of red flags about whether or not general election polls have a ton of merit, but if they do I'd imagine Biden is sitting a slight touch prettier than before the night started. He missed a chance to do even better, but I can't see Trump's performance causing many undecided or swing voters to move his direction. If he's truly ~10 points behind, he needs to do something different than what he showed tonight.

Ultimately, we learned tonight the best this sad political system has to offer us in 2020 is a couple too old, too rich, too white and too angry men who have years of poor decision making behind and seemingly ahead of them. Sad night.

After four years of Trump's faux alpha BS, America is ready for a "beta" (aka "decent human being") to lead it.

Drudge Report would ALWAYS have a who won poll on his website which was always swamped by GOP voters..

He didn't do that tonight...

He's so over Trump, it's not funny