Houshphandzadeh wrote:the bill has all the same "unless necessary" loopholes and incidents will still just be investigated and cleared by other cops. Republicans get to pass these and then point to protesters as unreasonable; Dems get to pretend they're doing something for their constituents

Houshphandzadeh wrote:1205 in regard to the loophole: "(b) Application.--The prohibitions under subsection (a)
shall not apply when the use of deadly force is permitted under
law."

but we know these sorts of bans don't work anyway. chokeholds have been banned in NYC since 93 but are still used regularly. when Dan Pantaleo murdered Eric Garner with one on video, it still took 5 years of protests just to get the cop fired

jamiethekiller wrote:the problem is that they all have the 'i finish the fight' mentality. they'll start it and use whatever force necessary to finish it.

traderdave wrote:

jamiethekiller wrote:the problem is that they all have the 'i finish the fight' mentality. they'll start it and use whatever force necessary to finish it.

Agree 100%, jamie. The problem really isn't the chokehold; it is the mentality of the people applying the chokehold. Hell, chokeholds are a staple of MMA and other self-defense disciplines. The purpose is to DEescalate a situation not perpetuate it. The pure, simple fact is that some men and women just do not have the temperament to be police officers. Even cops will tell you some of their fellow officers are fucking nuts. Go join the armed forces instead.

TenuredVulture wrote:

traderdave wrote:

jamiethekiller wrote:the problem is that they all have the 'i finish the fight' mentality. they'll start it and use whatever force necessary to finish it.

Agree 100%, jamie. The problem really isn't the chokehold; it is the mentality of the people applying the chokehold. Hell, chokeholds are a staple of MMA and other self-defense disciplines. The purpose is to DEescalate a situation not perpetuate it. The pure, simple fact is that some men and women just do not have the temperament to be police officers. Even cops will tell you some of their fellow officers are #$!&@ nuts. Go join the armed forces instead.

I think the armed forces have higher standards, and I think soldiers tend to be more disciplined than cops. Could be wrong about that though.

traderdave wrote:This may belong in the "Unpopular Opinions" thread but, regardless of what the law says, if I'm a cop in a fight for my life, I am doing whatever I have to do to get home to my family at the end of my shift.

Uncle Milty wrote:

traderdave wrote:This may belong in the "Unpopular Opinions" thread but, regardless of what the law says, if I'm a cop in a fight for my life, I am doing whatever I have to do to get home to my family at the end of my shift.

That's the prevailing attitude. Imagine if other community service professions thought the same way. Don't waste your time calling to the firefighters just start praying instead.

Beyond that, it's my impression that you wouldn't put yourself in positions that spark outrage. Most well considered opinions don't expect LE to never protect themselves. It's the poor judgement beforehand that unnecessarily places them into too many encounters and then the lack of judgement and restraint during them.

That's before we even touch on disproportionate policing of targeted people and communities.

thephan wrote:Since Don is promising 'long term jail sentences' for people who pull down statues on Federal lands, is he the guy who wants just sentences that fit the crime or is he the head cracker justice guy? Hard to tell unless you look through the lens of who he is pandering to.

Now distruction of Federal property is a crime on the books, so there is something to enforce no matter how one feels about it.

"any structure, plaque, statue or other monument on public property commemorating the service of any person or persons in the armed forces of the United States."

Phred wrote:

Uncle Milty wrote:

traderdave wrote:This may belong in the "Unpopular Opinions" thread but, regardless of what the law says, if I'm a cop in a fight for my life, I am doing whatever I have to do to get home to my family at the end of my shift.

That's the prevailing attitude. Imagine if other community service professions thought the same way. Don't waste your time calling to the firefighters just start praying instead.

Beyond that, it's my impression that you wouldn't put yourself in positions that spark outrage. Most well considered opinions don't expect LE to never protect themselves. It's the poor judgement beforehand that unnecessarily places them into too many encounters and then the lack of judgement and restraint during them.

That's before we even touch on disproportionate policing of targeted people and communities.

My opinion is that not enough LE know how to or aren't willing to deescalate a situation.

thephan wrote:The Police Officers Federation of Minneapolis board members were interview by CNN about proposed changes to policing and their potential concerns. Lt. Bob Kroll, the President of the Federation in saying that he would like patience and dialog as they move forward with this said, "lets not do it in a vacuum, lets not rush to get it done over night or in a week in a special session we need time, we have more of a focus on the safety and security of the citizens of Minneapolis then defeating bills that they want to rush through [under] the cover of darkness, we need time, everybody's got to take a breath."

I did my best to capture the whole quote from the TV and it is accurate. I assume that there was not any editing by CNN.

How tone deaf do you have to be?

King: How much more do you need to see to determine — to come out and say that this is not alright?

Rich Walker Sr.: Any human being that watched that knows that that shouldn't have ended the way it did, but we also know that there's more to the story. They say he never resisted in the statement's release. We don't know if he never resisted because we haven't seen from the time the officer stopped him until the point where he was on the ground.

King: Are you all saying to us that you can't really make a comment about this case until you see every piece of video associated with it? Is that what you're saying today?

Kroll: We would just like to see what we are entitled to in our agreement, in our policy, is our officer's body camera footage. It may shed some light that we're unaware of. ... Right now, we cannot make an informed decision regarding the other officers that do not appear on camera.