Grotewold wrote:And was the #2 in an administration like 65% of people pine for. Win and *then* do the Sanders stuff

Bucky wrote:sorry, that was a cheap shot, but i'm vibing grote's taek of let's run with the guy with the best chance to win

JFLNYC wrote:

Bucky wrote:sorry, that was a cheap shot, but i'm vibing grote's taek of let's run with the guy with the best chance to win

ABT.

JFLNYC wrote:

pacino wrote:you started this off with a rightwing smear delegitimizing the identity of being Palestinian;

Fiction.

pacino wrote:calling Israel's move stupid and short-sighted is not an ad hominem attack.

It is the exact opposite of short-sighted. Whether ultimately right or effective, it was nevertheless designed to address the long-term existential threat of a Palestinian majority in Israel.

pacino wrote:people living in a prison (whether open air, one essentially around their person as they see their identity and legitimacy stripped from them) and having their rights stripped from them take precedence for me over a law such as this.

Ironically you could just as well be describing being an Israeli Jew being surrounded by threatening Arab states, mortar-lobbing Palestinian Arabs and suicide-bombing murdering terrorists.

pacino wrote:ensuring Israel is secular is important for a better future for everyone living within Israel.

Not if you're an Israeli Jew and the consequence of being secular is ultimately a Palestinian majority in Israel, making Israel just another Muslim-dominated theocracy in the Middle East with Jews either being expelled, discriminated against or worse.

pacino wrote:That you side with the far rightwing in Israel says more about your thought process on this than anything I could type.

I've been accused of many things in my life but never before being right-wing.

pacino wrote:you subscribing to the idea of Zionism doesn't mean that those that don't are somehow bad or don't think about the rights of Jewish persons;

More fiction. I never said anyone not believing in Zionism is bad. And you may well think about the rights of Jews but if your thoughts are confined to the notion that a secular Israel is in the long run inevitably good for Jews you should reexamine that thought in the context of the experience of Jews in seemingly secular countries such as Germany, Austria and the Soviet Union historically, especially in the 20th century.

pacino wrote:rather, integration and living together is an important long-term goal for all of the global society, including those who live in modern day Israel.

Such simplistic platitudes ignore the reality that the State of Israel was created because Jews have systematically been denied not only the rights of "integration and living together" but the very right to life. It is impossible to engage in any meaningful discussion on the subject while ignoring historical attempts to exterminate Jews and modern and continuing attempts to wipe the State of Israel off the map.

pacino wrote:have a great day my friend!!!!

Seventy years ago, under infinitely more difficult circumstances, the Arabs chose conflict over peaceful co-existence. I wish I could believe your parting line reflected your stated desire for the latter.

TenuredVulture wrote:So the simplest explanation of congress not really pursuing the Russian influence on us elections is that many members are involved. Someone posted something here to that effect on this very board a few months ago. If that person is right, there is no reason to think at least a few dems aren't on the Kremlin's payroll.

Bucky wrote:sorry, that was a cheap shot, but i'm vibing grote's taek of let's run with the guy with the best chance to win

Werthless wrote:

Bucky wrote:sorry, that was a cheap shot, but i'm vibing grote's taek of let's run with the guy with the best chance to win

I'm skeptical that Biden gives the best chance for a win. It's a bit early. The Democratic party has not done well the last couple times they went with the candidate who was most "qualified" and had the best chance to win (2000, 2004, 2016).

Watergate tapes decision may have been wrong, Kavanaugh said in 1999

slugsrbad wrote:Trump going on an unhinged rant again this morning. Honestly the Republican leadership is fast approaching the point of no return, if they haven’t already.