slugsrbad wrote:Holy false equivalences Batman.

If you don't use a standard such as the law to justify running a senator out of office, you create a massive gray area, is my point.

slugsrbad wrote:I meant to say this hear, not in the other thread, but I want those sweet post counts:

McConnell is calling for an Ethics review of Al Franken in light of these allegations.

I believe he tried to expel someone in the past for sexual allegations but that person resigned. perhaps this will happen again.

Grotewold wrote:

slugsrbad wrote:Holy false equivalences Batman.

If you don't a standard such as the law to decide on running a senator out of office, you create a massive gray area, is my point.

There are moral standards to being a Senator. Many times, these men and women fall short, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try and hold them to that higher standard.

There is no grey area in the Franken case. None.

Franken says he is asking for an ethics investigation and will gladly cooperate. I don't think that's enough, as I have made abundantly clear.

If we want to be moral leaders, especially with the climate of revelation and catharsis, then Franken should step down.

slugsrbad wrote:There are moral standards to being a Senator. Many times, these men and women fall short, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try and hold them to that higher standard.

There is no grey area in the Franken case. None.

The grey area is where you draw the line of disqualification from office, not whether Franken was out of line in that situation.

I agree on the moral standard, which was my earlier point. There are lots of ways to fall short there, and it's gonna get really murky about who should go and who shouldn't.

slugsrbad wrote:Franken says he is asking for an ethics investigation and will gladly cooperate. I don't think that's enough, as I have made abundantly clear.

If we want to be moral leaders, especially with the climate of revelation and catharsis, then Franken should step down.

look at slugs 'WHITE KNIGHT' rbad over here!!!!


fwiw, I agree.

Does intent have anything to do with it? Clearly Franken wasn’t groping her to get his personal kicks. He was trying to be funny. He is smiling at the camera. Nobody is saying it is right, but it’s hugely different if he was copping a feel while she was sleeping to feel a boob.

D2S wrote:Does intent have anything to do with it? Clearly Franken wasn’t groping her to get his personal kicks. He was trying to be funny. He is smiling at the camera. Nobody is saying it is right, but it’s hugely different if he was copping a feel while she was sleeping to feel a boob.

She's wearing a flak jacket. Even if he wanted to cop a feel in this situation, he probably couldn't.

A damn shame that the person taking the picture didn't say something.

Al had a good run but he has to step down and he should do it quickly and with as much contrition as he can muster.

Honestly, a Senate ethics investigation could have lots and lots of collateral damage. Might not be a terrible thing. And, with any luck it will extend to the House and the White House.

But there really is no defense of Franken's behavior, regardless of the flak jacket, regardless of whether he's actually touching her or just miming groping, and regardless if he's doing it for a laugh rather than to satisfy some perversion. It's sexual assault.

Grotewold wrote:

slugsrbad wrote:There are moral standards to being a Senator. Many times, these men and women fall short, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try and hold them to that higher standard.

There is no grey area in the Franken case. None.

The grey area is where you draw the line of disqualification from office, not whether Franken was out of line in that situation.

I agree on the moral standard, which was my earlier point. There are lots of ways to fall short there, and it's gonna get really murky about who should go and who shouldn't.

Agree.

TenuredVulture wrote:Honestly, a Senate ethics investigation could have lots and lots of collateral damage. Might not be a terrible thing. And, with any luck it will extend to the House and the White House.

But there really is no defense of Franken's behavior, regardless of the flak jacket, regardless of whether he's actually touching her or just miming groping, and regardless if he's doing it for a laugh rather than to satisfy some perversion. It's sexual assault.

It seems pretty likely between this, the hearing earlier in the week and then just the general flow of how these things are going that we're going to get many more members of Congress wrapped up in these in the near future.

Speaking of politicians who should step down, mistrial declared in Menendez case.

The pee pee tape is of Trump semi-raping someone and this societal catharsis is happening now to give him cover when it's released. The media is all but controlled by the right, especially the sordid part of it.

Or not.

I think what Franken did in the pic is juvenile and probably something about a million people have done (or something similar). That said, I think he needs to step down if we are going to be able do what needs to be done. I'm disappointed because I like him and he's been a champion for women's rights.

Oh, and this ends any chance of Moore losing. The morons of Alabama are just looking for a reason to vote for the pedophile. Now they have it. Whataboutism.

slugsrbad wrote:Speaking of politicians who should step down, mistrial declared in Menendez case.

I believe this seat is up in 2018

PRIMARY HIS ASS

Monkeyboy wrote:Oh, and this ends any chance of Moore losing. The morons of Alabama are just looking for a reason to vote for the pedophile. Now they have it. Whataboutism.

I guess you saw John Oliver this week?

interesting new poll doe by HuffPo/Yougov :

Tribalism...

craptastic tax bill passed the House

all the PA Rs voted in the affirmative

Matt Friedman‏ @MattFriedmanNJ
Menendez: "To those who were digging my political grave so they could jump into my seat, I know who you are and I won’t forget you.” cc @bobtorricelli

He's really gonna try to run for re-election, huh

pacino wrote:craptastic tax bill passed the House

all the PA Rs voted in the affirmative

Bummer. Costello OUT.