19 Republican primary candidates and counting (politics!)

by **Gimpy** » Thu Jul 02, 2015 15:06:35

TomatoPie wrote:

by **Doll Is Mine** » Thu Jul 02, 2015 15:14:08

Jim Webb would make a good VP.

by **Werthless** » Thu Jul 02, 2015 16:37:43

td11 wrote:
SK790 wrote:doc's weirdness is one of my favorite things about this board. never change, pal.

doc is the best. it's hilarious to me when people say they don't understand his posts as an insult

I don't understand this post.

by **drsmooth** » Thu Jul 02, 2015 18:19:19

Werthless wrote:
td11 wrote:
SK790 wrote:doc's weirdness is one of my favorite things about this board. never change, pal.

doc is the best. it's hilarious to me when people say they don't understand his posts as an insult

I don't understand this post.

that's 2 posts

by **SK790** » Thu Jul 02, 2015 20:59:13

Bernie actually raised a bunch of money

by **Doll Is Mine** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 01:09:27

Doll Is Mine wrote:
Well, this is a backwoodsian tale of the macabre. WBIR.com reports that an East Tennessee hardware store owner has hung “what some call a controversial sign” that expresses his feelings about same-sex marriage.

In a spidery Sharpie scrawl, the sign simply reads “No Gays Allowed.” Yeah, WBIR, some people would call that controversial. At least.

Jeff Amyx, owner of Amyx Hardware & Roofing Supplies in Grainger County, thinks the sign demonstrates that he’s a brave Christian who’s not afraid to stand up for his beliefs.

“They gladly stand for what they believe in, why can’t I?” said Amyx.

So after getting quite a few complaints about the No Gays Allowed sign, including U-Haul dropping Amyx as a customer and demanding he take down its logo from his website, he replaced that sign with this one:

by **drsmooth** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 07:00:45

Doll Is Mine wrote:
So after getting quite a few complaints about the No Gays Allowed sign, including U-Haul dropping Amyx as a customer and demanding he take down its logo from his website, he replaced that sign with this one:

I have reservations about the guy's ability to detect these urges to abridge his rights in his customers

ok, more generally about his intelligence

though to be fair he does spell good

by **Werthless** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 07:05:37

Individuals cannot violate his 1st amendment rights; just government. Someone should tell him his sign doesn't apply to anyone.

by **drsmooth** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 07:39:26

Werthless wrote:Individuals cannot violate his 1st amendment rights; just government. Someone should tell him his sign doesn't apply to anyone.

It applies to "Them", dadgummit

by **drsmooth** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 07:41:01

Greeks shouldn't muddle their exasperation with Tsipras with their stand on austerity, but looks like they probably will

by **pacino** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 09:41:03

drsmooth wrote:Greeks shouldn't muddle their exasperation with Tsipras with their stand on austerity, but looks like they probably will

i sure hope not

by **Doll Is Mine** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:57:05

drsmooth wrote:Greeks shouldn't muddle their exasperation with Tsipras with their stand on austerity, but looks like they probably will

I spoke to my sister yesterday and she told me that people are terrified and are panicking. She thinks most will vote YES out of fear.

To make matters worse, those pushing the YES vote are telling people that if they vote NO, Greece will be kicked out of the Euro and they'll be forced to sell their islands to the Chinese. It's a mess.

by **Gimpy** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:31:20

My grandmother visited the U.S. from Greece for my sister's wedding a couple weeks ago. She's supposed to fly back on Thursday, but my dad told her she's not going back yet if they vote no.

by **pacino** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:39:32

What would a 'no' vote do to make Greece any less safe than a 'yes' vote?

by **jerseyhoya** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 13:01:53

drsmooth wrote:Greeks shouldn't muddle their exasperation with Tsipras with their stand on austerity, but looks like they probably will

As a poster who likes to pick on people for simple causal explanations, especially ones that are misleading, this seems like a post that drsmooth would enjoy attacking. I think the uncertainty and fear of what comes from a No vote described by Doll is Mine's sister is driving the vast majority of the Yes folks. Over 80% of Greeks want to stay with the Euro. It's not empty scaremongering from the Yes backers in Greece that they'll be kicked out of the Euro if No wins, given the power brokers in Brussles and Berlin are saying the same thing. The status quo is bad, but the logistical, economic, political, etc. issues involved in leaving the Euro and going back to the Drachma might end up being a lot worse.

Not that a lack of confidence in Tspiras isn't pushing some into the Yes camp, but it seems like very much a secondary factor. Other reasons I imagine some people are voting Yes include those who have any sort of savings are presumably desperate for a Yes vote because the subsequent devaluation from leaving the Euro would hit them the hardest. And normal people who are undecided on the referendum, see the Communists agreeing with the Neo-Nazis on a contentious issue and urging a No vote, and decide to vote in the opposite direction because seriously.

The best outcome for the Greeks would seem to be voting No and earning significant concessions/debt forgiveness as a result from people who ultimately decide not to pull the trigger on booting them from the Euro/not calling the Greek's bluff. But they're relying on the kindness of others for that to happen, and the people they're dealing with don't seem terribly nice. There are also a bunch of incentives for the remaining major Eurozone countries to drive a hard bargain on Greece/stick to the ouster threat as a warning to the larger wobbly countries like Spain and Italy to make sure their shit is together.

It's also a possibility that leaving the Euro will in the medium/long term be a significant benefit to Greece, but it's likely to be a short term catastrophe (on top of the current problems), and voters abhor uncertainty. The country is in such a bad way that the potential for it getting worse is less of a disincentive for change than it normally would be and voters could roll the dice, and I wouldn't blame them for voting No. But I also don't think you can blame them for voting Yes, or pin that on them confusing a dislike for their PM with their stand on austerity.

by **Monkeyboy** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 13:27:04

swishnicholson wrote:
Monkeyboy wrote:
TenuredVulture wrote:Kinda think Bernie's function is to either shift the conversation ever so slightly leftward, or make Hillary seem moderate to general election voters.

Yeh, that's what I've always assumed. But if his leadership in vermont is any indication of how he'd lead the country, I would prefer him to Hillary.

But, but Vermont is even worse than New Jersey in economic growth.

but it's so pretty, swish

by **Monkeyboy** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 13:29:08

pacino wrote:Bernie is a federal legislator. Vermont is a state.

I was thinking more of his time as major in burlington. He worked with both sides, was pragmatic, and open to alternative enrgy and other ideas that would move the country forward. I honestly don't know much about him as a legislator.

by **TenuredVulture** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 13:38:38

Monkeyboy wrote:
pacino wrote:Bernie is a federal legislator. Vermont is a state.

I was thinking more of his time as major in burlington. He worked with both sides, was pragmatic, and open to alternative enrgy and other ideas that would move the country forward. I honestly don't know much about him as a legislator.

Both sides? I don't know, but my impression of Burlington, VT is that it's pretty homogenous. I mean, you could almost say the same thing about Rick Perry (remember, Texas does produce a lot of wind generated electricity and Perry was very much in favor of the "Trans-Texas Corridor".)

by **Bucky** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 13:39:35

great, now I don't know WHO to vote for

by **Monkeyboy** » Fri Jul 03, 2015 13:49:45

jerseyhoya wrote:[ There are also a bunch of incentives for the remaining major Eurozone countries to drive a hard bargain on Greece/stick to the ouster threat as a warning to the larger wobbly countries like Spain and Italy to make sure their shit is together.
.

I think this is the one that would concern me the most, if I were Greek. There are legit concerns in europe about the euro as a whole and I don't think the ptb want to risk 3 or 4 countries defaulting. I could totally see them throwing Greece under the bus to send a message.

As an aside, my wife and I were there during the first crisis 4 or so years ago. We got the distinct impression that the Greeks are also very concerned about their antiquities and what the rest of Europe may do to reclaim their debt, including taking over many of the monuments, etc. We heard that from natives several times and almost had our camera confiscated when I filmed about 3 seconds of a room in Meteora before I saw the "no camera" sign. They thought we were German (I get that all the time) and wanted to know why we were there, etc. Once they realized we were americans, they relaxed and told us Germans were coming in and filming artifacts because they wanted to take them if the Greeks defaulted. It's probably just leftover fear from WWII and Hitler's efforts to gather antiquities, but I think it's worth noting. Like I said, we heard it 3 or 4 times.

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