slugsrbad wrote:man, I don't want to be alive for WWIII

By: BRADLEY KLAPPER (AP)
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WASHINGTON (AP) — A Senate investigation concludes waterboarding and other harsh interrogation methods provided no key evidence in the hunt for Osama bin Laden, according to congressional aides and outside experts familiar with a still-secret, 6,200-page report. The finding could deepen the worst rift in years between lawmakers and the CIA.

The CIA disputes the conclusion and already is locked with the Senate intelligence committee in an acrimonious fight amid dueling charges of snooping and competing criminal referrals to the Justice Department. The public may soon get the chance to decide, with the congressional panel planning to vote Thursday to demand a summary of its review be declassified.

From the moment of bin Laden's death almost three years ago, former Bush administration figures and top CIA officials have cited the evidence trail leading to the al-Qaida mastermind's walled Pakistani compound as vindication of the "enhanced interrogation techniques" they authorized after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

The most high-profile detainee linked to the bin Laden investigation was Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the accused 9/11 mastermind who was waterboarded 183 times. Mohammed, intelligence officials have noted, confirmed after his 2003 capture that he knew an important al-Qaida courier with the nom de guerre Abu Ahmed al-Kuwaiti.

The Senate report concludes such information wasn't critical, according to the aides. Mohammed only discussed al-Kuwaiti months after being waterboarded, while he was under standard interrogation, they said. And Mohammed neither acknowledged al-Kuwaiti's significance nor provided interrogators with the courier's real name

In any case, it still took the CIA years to learn al-Kuwaiti's real identity: Sheikh Abu Ahmed, a Pakistani man born in Kuwait. How the U.S. learned of Ahmed's name is still unclear.

Without providing full details, aides said the Senate report illustrates the importance of the National Security Agency's efforts overseas.

Intelligence officials have previously described how in the years when the CIA couldn't find where bin Laden's courier was, NSA eavesdroppers came up with nothing until 2010 — when Ahmed had a telephone conversation with someone monitored by U.S. intelligence.

At that point, U.S. intelligence was able to follow Ahmed to bin Laden's hideout

thephan wrote:

slugsrbad wrote:man, I don't want to be alive for WWIII

Russia is certainly winning the PsyOps at the moment. There are several areas quaking in fear of an aggressive Russia, restrained NATO, perceived weak US, and the economic dependency difficulties that the global market has created (specifically the price control of Russian Natural Gas). I am not sure how to read the tea leaves (ask LG, not the guy in the computer industry) about the gutted Russian manufacturing due to the fortunes brought to the country by Russian petrochemicals which has provided comfort and wealth that is not sustainable.

Luzinski's Gut wrote:I suppose that's always a possibility, but a lot of the senior Russian military believe in Putin, a lot of the Russian people believe in Putin as well.

Russia has been ruled by strongmen since the founding of the nation, and the people generally like that form of government.

So I don't think it's likely.

drsmooth wrote:

Luzinski's Gut wrote:I suppose that's always a possibility, but a lot of the senior Russian military believe in Putin, a lot of the Russian people believe in Putin as well.

Russia has been ruled by strongmen since the founding of the nation, and the people generally like that form of government.

So I don't think it's likely.

so what does/will motivate this crack fighting force to march off on any misadventure poots cooks up?

drsmooth wrote:

Luzinski's Gut wrote:I suppose that's always a possibility, but a lot of the senior Russian military believe in Putin, a lot of the Russian people believe in Putin as well.

Russia has been ruled by strongmen since the founding of the nation, and the people generally like that form of government.

So I don't think it's likely.

so what does/will motivate this crack fighting force to march off on any misadventure poots cooks up?

Luzinski's Gut wrote:http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/news_108501.htm

NATO just issued a redline for further Russian adventurism.

Gimpy wrote:

Luzinski's Gut wrote:http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/news_108501.htm

NATO just issued a redline for further Russian adventurism.

It's probably just one of those April Fools Jokes that NATO is so well known for.

Monkeyboy wrote:So any chance we can work with the Saudis and our own petroleum reserves to ramp up petroleum production enough to hurt Russia economically, as we did in the 80's? They can barely pay their debts and would certainly be hurt by a lowering of oil prices.

This Russian aggression is just another reason to hate oil companies and their willingness to block any form of alternative energy, imho. NATO is having trouble responding because they need that sweet, sweet oil.

Luzinski's Gut wrote:http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/news_108501.htm

NATO just issued a redline for further Russian adventurism.

Luzinski's Gut wrote:NATO-speak is amazing. Took me about six months to understand how they use language to press home a point.

"We support the sovereignty, political independence, and territorial integrity of all states within their internationally recognised borders. An independent, sovereign, and stable Ukraine, firmly committed to democracy and respect for human rights, minorities, and the rule of law, is key to Euro-Atlantic security."

Translation: Don't go any further or we'll do something. Sometime. Somehow.

"Today NATO and Ukraine have agreed, as set out in the statement by the NATO-Ukraine Commission, to implement immediate and longer-term measures in order to strengthen Ukraine’s ability to provide for its own security."

Translation: We'll sell you a bunch of modern equipment. We might chuck some troops under the radar to help you train as well.

"We have also today agreed a package of measures aimed at deepening our cooperation with other NATO partners in Eastern Europe, in consultation with them and within our existing bilateral programmes."

Translation: We're going to conduct some exercises with multi-national units, probably in Poland.

"We have decided to suspend all practical civilian and military cooperation between NATO and Russia."

Translation: Fuck you Russia. We're not helping you with any sort of capability. Have fun with the Chechens!

"We will continue to provide appropriate reinforcement and visible assurance of NATO’s cohesion and commitment to deterrence and collective defence against any threat of aggression to the Alliance."

Translation: Don't come across the international border between Russia and Ukraine. Any sort of adventurism in the Baltics will be met with a military response. Basically, they probably would invoke Article 5, which was invoked right after 9/11.