Biden has been having perfectly civil debates for decades. Even the Harris/Pence debate was relatively fine. Trump is clearly the variable here dragging everyone down. He doesn’t know anything substantive so he just falls back on insulting people or accusing them of crimes or lying or complaining people aren’t treating him fairly. I’m not sure what Biden or any candidate is supposed to do with that.

Gimpy wrote:

LastTrain wrote:The positive of Biden winning, to me, is the streets of our major cities should be relatively peaceful on election night. If Trump were in a better position to be re-elected I'd be nervous about the response from the radicalized left. The radicalized right has their guns but I don't see the same type of outburst. Some squirrels might want to start their hibernation now.

Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins? You know there have been multiple recent plots/attempts to kidnap or assassinate Democrat politicians including Biden and at least two governors, there have been right wing demonstrations where people carry assault weapons, and there have been several murders by right wingers, right?

Those radicalized antifa terrorists are the least effective people on the planet what with their zero fatalities so far.

When you view the world through the four walls around you and refuse to acknowledge the outside world, then yes.

Gimpy wrote:

LastTrain wrote:The positive of Biden winning, to me, is the streets of our major cities should be relatively peaceful on election night. If Trump were in a better position to be re-elected I'd be nervous about the response from the radicalized left. The radicalized right has their guns but I don't see the same type of outburst. Some squirrels might want to start their hibernation now.

Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins? You know there have been multiple recent plots/attempts to kidnap or assassinate Democrat politicians including Biden and at least two governors, there have been right wing demonstrations where people carry assault weapons, and there have been several murders by right wingers, right?

Those radicalized antifa terrorists are the least effective people on the planet what with their zero fatalities so far.

I expect gun violence if Biden wins, and property crimes if Trump wins.

Werthless wrote:

Gimpy wrote:

LastTrain wrote:The positive of Biden winning, to me, is the streets of our major cities should be relatively peaceful on election night. If Trump were in a better position to be re-elected I'd be nervous about the response from the radicalized left. The radicalized right has their guns but I don't see the same type of outburst. Some squirrels might want to start their hibernation now.

Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins? You know there have been multiple recent plots/attempts to kidnap or assassinate Democrat politicians including Biden and at least two governors, there have been right wing demonstrations where people carry assault weapons, and there have been several murders by right wingers, right?

Those radicalized antifa terrorists are the least effective people on the planet what with their zero fatalities so far.

I expect gun violence if Biden wins, and property crimes if Trump wins.

unfortunately i do agree with that and i do believe that the prior to be more isolated incidents and the latter being way more widespread. actually expecting total chaos if trump would win. shit will go down.

Werthless wrote:

Gimpy wrote:

LastTrain wrote:The positive of Biden winning, to me, is the streets of our major cities should be relatively peaceful on election night. If Trump were in a better position to be re-elected I'd be nervous about the response from the radicalized left. The radicalized right has their guns but I don't see the same type of outburst. Some squirrels might want to start their hibernation now.

Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins? You know there have been multiple recent plots/attempts to kidnap or assassinate Democrat politicians including Biden and at least two governors, there have been right wing demonstrations where people carry assault weapons, and there have been several murders by right wingers, right?

Those radicalized antifa terrorists are the least effective people on the planet what with their zero fatalities so far.

I expect angry gun violence if Biden wins, and property crimes and celebratory gun violence if Trump wins.

Fixed that for you. Trump encourages his supporters to shoot people.

https://www.startribune.com/charges-boo ... 572843802/

Relevant, the FBI is charging members of a right wing group with inciting the riot that resulted in the Minny police precinct burning down (including opening fire on the precinct) as part of a larger coordinated effort by the group to ramp up violence during the protests.

the left and right of the political spectrum are simply mirror opposites of one another.

the bugaloo boys are to anarchists as the tea party is to progressives.

who has been murdered by an anarchist?

Houshphandzadeh wrote:who has been murdered by an anarchist?

they don't like to get their hands dirty as much and prefer others to do their work they instigate. same concept tho. both groups POS.

Gimpy wrote:Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins?

After this comment you made a leap from a context of violence to a context of death. That's essentially taking the jtk approach to discussing the pandemic and I think we'd both agree that's not the most honest or beneficial way to address the entire topic.

So sticking with this opening comment, my answer is yes. Are you saying you would not expect violence from the left if Trump wins?

If Biden wins, I don't expect the widespread nature of violence as I'd expect if Trump wins. By and large, I believe the most diehard Trump supporters will fade with him. This might be partly due to the fact Trump won't die an immediate political death if he goes the route of contesting everything through the courts. That would allow the fervor of the moment to dissipate a little more gradually. But even if it is so lopsided Trump concedes on election night, I don't see any major violent response from his so-called militias. That's mostly because I don't see Trump leaving the presidency maintaining strong political clout in the party. I think most Rs will quickly distance themselves from him, and are already beginning to do so with the handwriting on the wall.

azrider wrote:everyone criticizes the republicans as being this outwardly racist party and often mention how few candidates and supporters they have, yet the few they have are called uncle tom's and other racists names by leftists and democrats. brilliant strategy of the left.

I think the criticism is of their "let's go back to the 1950s" platform, which is not appealing to most minorities, for obvious reasons.

06hawkalum wrote:

azrider wrote:everyone criticizes the republicans as being this outwardly racist party and often mention how few candidates and supporters they have, yet the few they have are called uncle tom's and other racists names by leftists and democrats. brilliant strategy of the left.

I think the criticism is of their "let's go back to the 1950s" platform, which is not appealing to most minorities, for obvious reasons.

Abraham Lincoln was a Republican, therefore, our party isn't racist!

PTOITWCFTPP wrote:

06hawkalum wrote:

azrider wrote:everyone criticizes the republicans as being this outwardly racist party and often mention how few candidates and supporters they have, yet the few they have are called uncle tom's and other racists names by leftists and democrats. brilliant strategy of the left.

I think the criticism is of their "let's go back to the 1950s" platform, which is not appealing to most minorities, for obvious reasons.

Abraham Lincoln was a Republican, therefore, our party isn't racist!

That's my favorite strawman, usually coupled with "the KKK was founded by Democrats!!!"

06hawkalum wrote:

azrider wrote:everyone criticizes the republicans as being this outwardly racist party and often mention how few candidates and supporters they have, yet the few they have are called uncle tom's and other racists names by leftists and democrats. brilliant strategy of the left.

I think the criticism is of their "let's go back to the 1950s" platform, which is not appealing to most minorities, for obvious reasons.

And a lot of prominent minority members of the Republican party say the same racist shit, it just appears less racist coming from a person who isn't white

PTOITWCFTPP wrote:

06hawkalum wrote:

azrider wrote:everyone criticizes the republicans as being this outwardly racist party and often mention how few candidates and supporters they have, yet the few they have are called uncle tom's and other racists names by leftists and democrats. brilliant strategy of the left.

I think the criticism is of their "let's go back to the 1950s" platform, which is not appealing to most minorities, for obvious reasons.

Abraham Lincoln was a Republican, therefore, our party isn't racist!

Would love for them to go to the deep south and ask some hardcore MAGAs their opinion on Lincoln

LastTrain wrote:

Gimpy wrote:Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins?

After this comment you made a leap from a context of violence to a context of death. That's essentially taking the jtk approach to discussing the pandemic and I think we'd both agree that's not the most honest or beneficial way to address the entire topic.

So sticking with this opening comment, my answer is yes. Are you saying you would not expect violence from the left if Trump wins?

If Biden wins, I don't expect the widespread nature of violence as I'd expect if Trump wins. By and large, I believe the most diehard Trump supporters will fade with him. This might be partly due to the fact Trump won't die an immediate political death if he goes the route of contesting everything through the courts. That would allow the fervor of the moment to dissipate a little more gradually. But even if it is so lopsided Trump concedes on election night, I don't see any major violent response from his so-called militias. That's mostly because I don't see Trump leaving the presidency maintaining strong political clout in the party. I think most Rs will quickly distance themselves from him, and are already beginning to do so with the handwriting on the wall.

Fwiw we just had an election 4 years ago where the democratic candidate won the popular vote by over 3 million and lost the electoral college by 70,000 votes in 3 states and everyone more or less accepted the results. Can you imagine how trump would have reacted to a result like that going the other way? Or something like 2000?

In some ways we are very lucky that Biden has this large structural disadvantage with the electoral college because I don’t think we’d want to see how trump would react to winning the popular vote but losing the Electoral College. But then again, a lot of what is driving the trump movement is a dwindling portion of the population feeling like the world is trying to silence them despite having obvious structural advantages so maybe it couldn’t exist the other way.

If Biden wins by like 15 million votes and gets 400 EVs yeah that would probably calm most people down but If it’s close you know trump will raise a stink and people will follow him. Like that seems without question at this point, the guy is going on TV every night telling people not to accept the results if they don’t go his way, as well as calling for his political opponents arrest. He’s saying this to millions of people every night, some people are going to take him seriously. If it’s very close it leads right into the whole Q thing that there’s some huge conspiracy against him. How much “violence” that leads to, I don’t know and really hope we don’t find out.

I think the issue is you keep discussing violence “from the left” which at least I take to mean there would be some sort of organized/coordinated effort, and there doesn’t seem to be much recent history of that. Protests and spillover property damage sure. The far right groups are much more organized, and trump is much more inclined to encourage them. He’s also much more inclined to take actions that embroil people’s emotions on either side. He’s really the epicenter of all of this.

From Jonathan Lai of the Inky:

The Pennsylvania Supreme Court says mail ballots cannot be rejected “based on signature comparison conducted by county election officials or employees, or as the result of third-party challenges based on signature analysis and comparisons.”

@JoeBiden
After eight months of this pandemic, we finally found President Trump's plan to beat COVID-19.
Donald Trump’s COVID-19 plan


Everyone who's seen President Trump's COVID-19 plan says it's tremendous.

trumpcovidplan.com
3:32 PM · Oct 23, 2020·TweetDeck

https://trumpcovidplan.com/

In the event he loses Republicans will be cautious about putting too much distance between themselves and Trump and/or otherwise antagonizing him for the same reason they are spineless now: His Twitter followers. No Republican can win an election without the widespread support of Trump’s followers and, with one tweet, Trump can undo that support. Trump will also continue to have the message multiplier of either Fox News (he’s great ratings for them, in or out of office) or his own network.

It would certainly be nice if Trump were to lose and fade away along with his followers but it would be naive to count on it. In addition to enriching himself, there are a lot of people who make a lot of money off Trump controversy. There will be no shortage of that controversy anytime in the foreseeable future regardless of the result of the election.

LastTrain wrote:

Gimpy wrote:Are you saying you’d expect violence from the left if Trump wins?

After this comment you made a leap from a context of violence to a context of death. That's essentially taking the jtk approach to discussing the pandemic and I think we'd both agree that's not the most honest or beneficial way to address the entire topic.

So sticking with this opening comment, my answer is yes. Are you saying you would not expect violence from the left if Trump wins?

If Biden wins, I don't expect the widespread nature of violence as I'd expect if Trump wins. By and large, I believe the most diehard Trump supporters will fade with him. This might be partly due to the fact Trump won't die an immediate political death if he goes the route of contesting everything through the courts. That would allow the fervor of the moment to dissipate a little more gradually. But even if it is so lopsided Trump concedes on election night, I don't see any major violent response from his so-called militias. That's mostly because I don't see Trump leaving the presidency maintaining strong political clout in the party. I think most Rs will quickly distance themselves from him, and are already beginning to do so with the handwriting on the wall.

So death is a dishonest barometer when talking about violence; I’m curious what the honest measurement is.

The right wing is far ahead in deaths (bad measurement), violent threats, foiled plots to assassinate/kidnap politicians (including the recent string and more aged ones like our old pal the MAGA bomber), and political leaders calling for violence.

If you want to equate this summer’s protests with violence and the protests themselves with the left, then I don’t think the left is even behind there considering the overwhelming amount of violence against the protestors. I also don’t think those protests were about left vs right so much as they were about racial equality (which is a goal of many on the left, but the protests themselves were more motivated by systemic racism). Additionally, we’ve seen that a large amount of damage was done by agitators and opportunists who were unaffiliated with the protests themselves.