TomatoPie wrote:

PTOITWCFTPP wrote:Who are the real candidates?

Biden
Pete
Beto
Bernie

Is that it?

Tier One
Warren
Biden
Bernie
Bootyjuggs
Harris

Tier Two
Klobuchar
Booker

But it's VERY early, who had Obama near the top in May of 2007?

Everyone?

jerseyhoya wrote:

TomatoPie wrote:

PTOITWCFTPP wrote:Who are the real candidates?

Biden
Pete
Beto
Bernie

Is that it?

Tier One
Warren
Biden
Bernie
Bootyjuggs
Harris

Tier Two
Klobuchar
Booker

But it's VERY early, who had Obama near the top in May of 2007?

Everyone?

May 2008 maybe.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... n-191.html

By May 2008 he was on the verge of being the nominee.

On this day in 2007, Clinton was at 36.2% in the RCP average and Obama was at 25.3%.

I feel like there's been a lot of revisionist stuff on Obama coming from nowhere, when he was a huge deal post 2004 convention, and was an immediate top tier candidate when he announced (though still an underdog to Hillary).

jerseyhoya wrote:By May 2008 he was on the verge of being the nominee.

On this day in 2007, Clinton was at 36.2% in the RCP average and Obama was at 25.3%.

I feel like there's been a lot of revisionist stuff on Obama coming from nowhere, when he was a huge deal post 2004 convention, and was an immediate top tier candidate when he announced (though still an underdog to Hillary).

I suppose I thought he meant AT the top. But yeah, he was always #2 to Hillary until early 2008 where he hit a huge bump, maybe around debates? And basically didn't relinquish it.

PTOITWCFTPP wrote:Who are the real candidates?

Beto

Good god no.

Can we just do 4 debates spread out from Monday-Thursday with like 6 people on stage for each one?

Let’s just round robin the crap out of everyone.

TomatoPie wrote:

PTOITWCFTPP wrote:Who are the real candidates?

Biden
Pete
Beto
Bernie

Is that it?

Tier One
Warren
Biden
Bernie
Bootyjuggs
Harris

Tier Two
Klobuchar
Booker

But it's VERY early, who had Obama near the top in May of 2007?

This is a good list. I like Klobuchar first, Warren second, Biden third, then Harris. I think Biden/Warren is the best ticket. Klobuchar/Warren is probably the smartest/most intelligent ticket.

The Warren problem is that real deep wonk progressives love her, but she is negative on the charisma scale. She loses to Trump. I'd vote enthusiastically for Klobuchar or MajorPete, but I'd have to hold my nose to vote for Warren.

TomatoPie wrote:The Warren problem is that real deep wonk progressives love her, but she is negative on the charisma scale. She loses to Trump. I'd vote enthusiastically for Klobuchar or MajorPete, but I'd have to hold my nose to vote for Warren.

Please tell us why you would hold your nose to vote for her except 'charisma'.

Also I will bet that a lot of people are worried about Warren's electability have only seen small clips of her. She's fairly engaging in most settings I've seen.

But the way she pronounces “eduction” is a real problem

Don’t know if Klobuchar has more charisma than Warren, but to each their own.

Annoyed that it’s come to this—debating which candidate has the most charisma and the most electability while the issues take a back seat. I get it, Trump needs to go, but but it’s still disappointing.

CalvinBall wrote:Biden national campaign HQ will be in Philadelphia

Creepy Uncle Joe is a disaster. The DNC just won't stand down. He won't beat 45.

JUburton wrote:Also I will bet that a lot of people are worried about Warren's electability have only seen small clips of her. She's fairly engaging in most settings I've seen.

I wish she wouldn't have done the Native American card - that sux. She's the best on policy so far and is the most specific of anyone. I'm not sure she can beat 45. Many men won't vote for a woman period. Many Wall St dems won't vote for anyone with progressive policies and taxing the 1% more. She and Bernie together might make a run but who gets what role? They can't both be the Alpha. Her with Kamala is two women and a woman of color. Her with the Indiana guy - I don't know.

Look at the demographic breakdowns on 45's supporters. White men. A lot of white women. A lot of people wouldn't announce it publicly but voted for him. There needs to be a massive turn out if we don't change the electoral college situation. 45 will lose in a popular vote against a lot of people. But not with our antiquated system that isn't truly 1 person 1 vote. And, until we nationalize elections and take the local stuff out of the states hands - we will continue to have rigged disttircs, purged voter rolls and a lot of disenfranchisement.

The problem with the Dems, is that it hasn't been a progressive party for a long time. DNC dems took over and it became another party of the rich with a cosmetic fake humanity. We'll let the gays marry and keep some programs for the poor, pay lip service to the remaining unions. They have still be Hawkish in foreign matters and with NAFTA and GATT clinton's led the way for the globailzation game.

There isn't enough of a movement for social democrats let alone Green or true Socialist party. And so we're stuck...

I thought it could never get worse than Reagan, then we got Bush Jr for 8 years. Now we have things I could not have imagined in my wildest imagination. Hate mongering, rise of White Nationalism, buffonery, no pretense to have any real legitimate governance. Cabinet filled with reactionay Billionaires. With the most rigged and conservative SCOTUS in my lifetime.

Civil War it will be which I think has been the intnetion from the extremists all along.

It's possible for a President and or COngress to add more seats to the SCOTUS, could change it from 9 to 11, there is precedence for that but who knows.

With the Alabamas and Mississippis and Montanas and even some rust belt - Scott Walker was Wisconsin - so who knows... but we don't have a true reflection in our national govt of the true majority. We have extremist factions well positioned to exert more control than they have earned or deserve. Not even close to Democracy.

The rich fund it all. Citizen's United was a disaster.

It's dark days - and if the polar caps shift magnetism as I've been reading about - if the tipping point which most say has already occured accelerates the results so that by 2030 we're where they thought we'd be in 2050. Man, look out. People will kill each other for water, air, food, power -

45 is a fraud. He got in to position by feeding on the very worst of people's fears and prejudices and has stoked the flames - using the Fox News propoganda bureau which is as bad as any KGB or Staji apparatus.

facts? what are facts. If the sh** sticks. Shooting up Synagogues is normalized. Shooting Black people because their Black is normalized. The popo is armed to the teeth.

Give me a couple baby dragons and I'll go Dracarus on some mfers.

Trump National, which cut down a few hundred trees on the Potomac without a permit, will not pay the nominal $400 fine, which the county already wasted investigating. Instead the company filed an engineering plan that can be summed up as this: with nearly 14,000 square miles of river a few trees will not make a difference. The local supervisor sided with the business saying that if it were a private resident you never would have heard of this at all.

So the club is not going to do anything, not even replant for erosion control because it is a big river. For the county's part, it seems to have no inclination to perform an impact study around erosion control, fish estuaries, wet lands, tree canopy, etc. to understand if there is any damage.

we needed to expand a building for a new plant site we're building. Its in Luxembourg. We needed to remove about 15 more trees or so. The solution was that if we removed the tree's we had to find somewhere else in the migration pattern of those birds to plant new trees. So we had to approach several farms, private residences and building centers to see if we could pay them to plant trees.

Starting to become more and more clear that Mueller wasn’t done his work, and that Barr came in and shut it all down.

For gods sake trumps personal lawyer is on a recorded call urging a key witness to obstruct justice.

Philly the Kid wrote:

CalvinBall wrote:Biden national campaign HQ will be in Philadelphia

Creepy Uncle Joe is a disaster. The DNC just won't stand down. He won't beat 45.

What exactly do you think the DNC does

My Campaign for President was conclusively spied on. Nothing like this has ever happened in American Politics. A really bad situation. TREASON means long jail sentences, and this was TREASON!

It is also clear that there is not an understanding in any sense what treason is or what the remedies are.