JUburton wrote:

mozartpc27 wrote:And to be honest, I am not sure why any democrat, from a purely strategic view, wants the man impeached. Best case scenario for the country policy wise IMHO is that this pattern continues every day until Trump leaves office, be that three and a half years from now or seven and a half years from now: as long as every day is a firestorm of "what now?" With him, they'll get little to nothing done. Hit the reset button with Pence, and who knows what nasty, backward, poverty-punishing, worker-hating legislation will pass for governance in this country.

I want more of the same for as long as he is in office, which I hope ends only when he is sent packing by a resounding and thorough rejection by this country's voters.

Donald Trump is a foreign policy disaster waiting to happen. An existential threat to democracy. At least Pence has a brain cell. The policies will be no worse under him than under Trump.

I get the point, though. Pence could be worse because he could actually be effective in helping implement the conservative agenda and won't get up everyday tweeting about the scandal which broke the night before. It's a Hobson's Choice but, on balance, just getting that idiotic, democracy-smashing, pussy-grabbing, wall-building, immigrant-deporting, war-inciting, lying, sad excuse for a human being named Trump out of the White House will be worth it.

Mike "duly elected despite losing the popular vote by 3+ million" Pence is going to do great things for the LGBTQ community. The damage done to this country already is so demoralizing. But hey, at least jh might not have to worry so much about icky abortions!

Soren wrote:Mike "duly elected despite losing the popular vote by 3+ million" Pence is going to do great things for the LGBTQ community. The damage done to this country already is so demoralizing. But hey, at least jh might not have to worry so much about icky abortions!

You nailed it

that strategy would be the Dems version of party over country, sorry no. I have higher standards. If Trump acted criminally then he needs to go, period

Stephen "Muslim travel ban" Miller writing drumpf's speech on Islam for delivery in Saudi Arabia. This will be fine.

Trump loyalists pay little heed to revelations:

“I tuned it out,” said 44-year-old Michele Velardi, a mother of three sons, during a break from her job at a Staten Island hair salon. “I didn’t want to be depressed. I don’t want to feel that he’s not doing what he said, so I just choose to not listen.”

A few blocks away, die-hard Trump supporter Joseph Amodeo, 19, incorrectly praised the president for raising New York’s minimum wage, something enacted by Democrats in the Legislature. The college student had little understanding of the Trump administration’s deepening political struggles, but he offered a stern message to Trump’s critics.

“If you’re wishing for him to fail, you’re basically wishing for the pilot of the plane to crash,” Amodeo said. “You just gotta stick by him and hopefully he does things that benefit everyone.”

In Denison, Iowa, 60-year-old Mark Feller said he would support Trump’s 2020 re-election without question, despite concerns over what Feller described as chaos in the Oval Office. The furniture dealer doesn’t believe reports that the president asked Comey to back off his investigation before firing him.

“If it were true, it would bother me. But I don’t think it’s true,” Feller said.

But his son, 27-year-old Robbie Foy, said he hasn’t paid close attention to the news in recent days. He’s not backing off his initial reasons for supporting the president. Chief among them: his sustained disdain for Trump’s opponent, Democrat Hillary Clinton.

“Trump’s not in it for the money. He’s got plenty of money,” the younger Foy said. Clinton, he added, “was in it for herself.”

“Not only have I not heard of anyone turning their backs, I’ve seen people become more in solidarity with the president because they feel he’s getting a raw deal,” Castorina said.

Indeed, inside Staten Island’s Cabinet Plant, store co-owner Paul Lopa, 41, said there’s “nothing right now big enough” that could shake his support in Trump.

“I think he’s going more and more into the right direction,” Lopa said.

Down the street, Andrew Ottrando, a 56-year-old truck driver, said, “The Comey stuff is a joke.”

Could anything persuade him to abandon Trump?

“If he gases his own people, yeah I would be against him,” Ottrando said, saying afterward that he was only joking.

if you want to know why Trump continues to revel in liberal tears and in the election, it's because that's all his diehard voters need to stay on the TRUMP TRAIN. The ones who voted for him for the supreme court justice are the ones to watch, imo. they may stay home in 2018. Democrats need to get out voters with policies that will help them.

the Donald Trump presidency is terrible for liberals, and for the policies we believe in. Wanting him to remain in office because Pence may become president is folly, imo. Congress is acting regardless of the crap spewing out of the White House.

Labor is going to get destroyed in the UK. Corbyn is pretty bad at running stuff and fairly uninspiring. it's so pathetic how they can't take advantage of anything.

I don't think that Rump supporters and Pence supporters are necessarily the same people.

Rump campaigned on NOT being a career politician but on being a superior negotiator/businessman which Pence is not.

If Rump goes out, does the new guy pick a new cabinet?

Mike Lee is on the healthcare negotiation team and he's suggesting that states should have to opt IN to ACA regulations, not opt out or request a waiver.

this is going so well for liberals.

Phred wrote:I don't think that Rump supporters and Pence supporters are necessarily the same people.

Rump campaigned on NOT being a career politician but on being a superior negotiator/businessman which Pence is not.

If Rump goes out, does the new guy pick a new cabinet?

no. the cabinet is basically a conservative wet dream; it'd be very hard to 'upgrade'.

pacino wrote:Mike Lee is on the healthcare negotiation team and he's suggesting that states should have to opt IN to ACA regulations, not opt out or request a waiver.

this is going so well for liberals.

cbo score can't some soon enough. make this as politically toxic as possible.

but they'll just say hurrrr that was for the old house bill i guess

Grotewold wrote:

mozartpc27 wrote:And to be honest, I am not sure why any democrat, from a purely strategic view, wants the man impeached.

There's the less chance of everybody dying aspect

Yes, Pence is less likely to drop us into nuclear war, IMO.

Tweet from the orange man from back in 2014:

Tell Saudi Arabia and others that we want (demand!) free oil for the next ten years or we will not protect their private Boeing 747s.Pay up!

Now's your chance!

Donald Trump is a cancer on the standing of our nation. It's best for all concerned if he's gone.

As a Democrat, I'd make sure to keep reminding everyone that the Republican party foisted him upon us and would rather 'battle' Pence/Ryan on ideas. I think we'd win. I'd rather not continue sacrificing our standing in the world and continue seeing absolute incompetence from the Presidency for some theoretical political 'gains'.

And if you actually think a nation where we'd theoretically elect President Mr Trump to a second term would be good for liberals or Democrats, i'd wonder if you smoked some spiked shit when you posted that. The Supreme Court would go 6-3 or 7-2 by the end of those 8 years.

i'd much rather live in a world where werthless doesn't have to vote for the Democratic nominee because an entire party has gone absolute bonkers crazy.

Well, I think they got us...

msnbc and CNN have seen ratings spike for their night time programming. Maddow is actually #1 in her slot, which is pretty crazy considering FOX News is on the main package for a lot of cable bundles and it is not. The reason FOX has lagged? It hasn't actually been covering the story that cable news viewers overall want to watch (Comey).

all of this means msnbc should hire more conservatives like George Will and Greta van Susteren, I guess!

greta van slytherin

Werthless wrote:

Grotewold wrote:

mozartpc27 wrote:And to be honest, I am not sure why any democrat, from a purely strategic view, wants the man impeached.

There's the less chance of everybody dying aspect

Yes, Pence is less likely to drop us into nuclear war, IMO.

I'll expand on why, if you are an American, you should want Trump should be removed from office ASAP.

All throughout 2016 on BSG, many folks were beating the drum about normalizing Trump's abhorrent behavior. He attacked the impartiality of a judge based on his ethnicity, encouraged violence at his rallies, suggested that his opponent should be in jail, and just said whatever popped into his mind with no thought about the foreign policy consequences. He exhibited a gleeful lack of curiosity on policy, and was proud of his ignorance on many issues. That's part of what people liked about him, that he said what was on his mind with no filter. He disregarded the traditional norms of behavior that we expect from someone running for President, and some people loved it. He was an outsider.

What has made America great? It's our norms and institutions. Our optimism. Our sense of independence, our moral compass. Our respect for law, and our separation of powers. Our traditional support of free markets over one favoring collusion and cartels.

The sooner Trump is out of office, the sooner that any replacement can go back to supporting the American institutional belief systems of respect for the rule of law, judicial independence, freedom of the press, respect for women and minorities, etc. Even if Pence is not ideal for liberal folks, Trump is awful for America, and erodes the principles that make America great. Elections have consequences, and 4 years of Republican control is the consequence of the 2016 loss. Let's hope it's not 4 years of Trump eroding our international standing, and weakening the traditions that have led to American excellence.

ok, this is insane