Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby jerseyhoya » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:07:32

td11 wrote:i just really don't know what to say when you start attacking obama on foreign policy, especially compared to romney. he's an amazing statesman. just agree to disagree i guess

Nobel Peace Prize winner!

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby td11 » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:15:35

this is what i mean

While Romney was very critical of Obama in a morning statement on the Libya attacks, senior Republicans across the board avoided criticizing the administration shortly after Stevens’ death was announced.

Obama didn’t even get a mention in most GOP press statements blasted Wednesday morning.


Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/09 ... z26JecZnX0
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby jerseyhoya » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:29:37

Because those statements were released after Stevens' death was announced

They were responding to incredibly different information than was available at the time Romney's camp put out a statement

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby TenuredVulture » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:36:22

I'm behind the curve on all this, but do the Romney people really think a more aggressive foreign policy (MORE WAR! WAR WITH IRAN! DEFEND ISRAEL!) is really a political winner?
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby td11 » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:38:30

jerseyhoya wrote:Because those statements were released after Stevens' death was announced

They were responding to incredibly different information than was available at the time Romney's camp put out a statement


yes exactly thank you. so why did presidential candidate mitt romney decide to go balls out at 10:15pm last night? it's so dumb
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby CalvinBall » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:39:31

Maybe I'm making it up but I feel like jerz said it was dumb.

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby td11 » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:42:56

jerseyhoya wrote:It was an opportunistic statement to make, and he should've waited until morning. There was no compelling reason to get out in front of the story, and if they'd held off for 12 hours, they would have found out the ambassador died, and the tone of the statement would have been completely different.


i guess i'm nitpicking but no, he did not say it was dumb.
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby The Dude » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:45:14

saying it was opportunistic and there was no compelling reason for doing it says "dumb"
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby td11 » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:46:23

td11 wrote:
i guess i'm nitpicking
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby The Dude » Wed Sep 12, 2012 23:50:24

don't have the disclaimer then
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby td11 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:08:30

Sen. Jon Kyl on US Embassy statement: "this is like a judge telling the woman that got raped, you asked for it because of the way you dressed."


what
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby jerseyhoya » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:14:20

td11 wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:Because those statements were released after Stevens' death was announced

They were responding to incredibly different information than was available at the time Romney's camp put out a statement


yes exactly thank you. so why did presidential candidate mitt romney decide to go balls out at 10:15pm last night? it's so dumb

What are you thanking me for? Reps and Senators don't have massive staffs like a presidential campaign that churn out press statements late at night. By the time that they got into their offices in the AM things were different. It wasn't like there was any reason to suspect that the ambassador would end up dead when the Romney campaign put out their release. It's dangerous to wade into developing situations, and I'm sure if the Romney campaign had it to do all over again they would have waited. It's not like they needed to make a statement to make sure it was something people would pay attention to, so jumping in before the dust settled wasn't a good idea.

But it only really looks like a bad idea because it ended up being bad. It didn't have to end up bad if things went differently. You can't judge Romney's statement in comparison to the others because they were responding to completely different things.
Last edited by jerseyhoya on Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:14:59, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby td11 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:14:56

i think the difference between the articles jerz posted about why all those tweets were a bad idea is much different than what romney is trying to say, which is something like, "the embassy should've just told those angry muslims outside the walls to fuck off, USA! USA!"

imho
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby pacino » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:17:22

the libya one was likely not even about the video and was just an opportune time for them to pull the trigger on an attack already being planned on the embassy
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby jerseyhoya » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:19:24

td11 wrote:i think the difference between the articles jerz posted about why all those tweets were a bad idea is much different than what romney is trying to say, which is something like, "the embassy should've just told those angry muslims outside the walls to fuck off, USA! USA!"

imho

The first article was telling them and the rest of the world to eat our taint because we respect freedom of speech in our country unlike what they do in Egypt and Western Europe and if they can't understand that they should go fuck themselves.

imho

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby jerseyhoya » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:25:27

pacino wrote:the libya one was likely not even about the video and was just an opportune time for them to pull the trigger on an attack already being planned on the embassy

Indeed

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby Wolfgang622 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:42:48

I really don't see anything wrong with an embassy under seige from angry Islamic protesters issuing a statement about America's commitment to freedom of religion and emphasizing that those who were mocking Muhammed do not in any way speak for the United States government. That's damage control 101. Nor do I see any reason to believe that a statement issued under such circumstances would have been run by President Obama first, considering that (1) timeliness was an issue, (2) the message issuers were half a world away, and (3) the intended audience was not the American people, and if the attack in Libya had not resulted in the deaths of four American Civil servants we likely never would have heard the text of what was essentially a press release to the locals in Cairo.

In short, Romney's statement on the matter - calling the statement an "apology" and ascribing direct responsibility and blame for the supposed "apology" to President Obama - proves him a liar, and a dirtbag, unfit for office. I hope he rots in hell.
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby pacino » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:43:54

evangelical muslims need to get out of the 15th century and get over films and depictions of muhammad. your faith must be shit if you are threatened by a crappy, dumb film by crazies. guess what? us non-muslims don't have to follow the rules you fundamentalist muslims do. so dont get mad when we dont.
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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby jerseyhoya » Thu Sep 13, 2012 00:52:57

mozartpc27 wrote:I really don't see anything wrong with an embassy under seige from angry Islamic protesters issuing a statement about America's commitment to freedom of religion and emphasizing that those who were mocking Muhammed do not in any way speak for the United States government. That's damage control 101. Nor do I see any reason to believe that a statement issued under such circumstances would have been run by President Obama first, considering that (1) timeliness was an issue, (2) the message issuers were half a world away, and (3) the intended audience was not the American people, and if the attack in Libya had not resulted in the deaths of four American Civil servants we likely never would have heard the text of what was essentially a press release to the locals in Cairo.

In short, Romney's statement on the matter - calling the statement an "apology" and ascribing direct responsibility and blame for the supposed "apology" to President Obama - proves him a liar, and a dirtbag, unfit for office. I hope he rots in hell.

The statement was released before there was a protest, but the embassy doubled down on it the wake of the embassy being stormed. I'm pretty sure we'd have heard about the statement in the wake of the embassy being swarmed/our flag being burned/etc regardless of what happened in Libya. At this point last night, the statement (and higher ups in the administration backtracking from it) was the big story.

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Re: Don't Fact Check Me, Bro: The Politics Thread

Postby Wolfgang622 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 01:08:01

Frankly, the ludicrous use of that statement as some kind of political football, and the attempt to use the statement as evidence of Obama's secret-Muslim-anti-semite agenda, by some of those on the right, should serve as an urgent reminder of the dire need to wipe stupid, violent, short-sighted, imperialistic NeoCon thinking from the face of our political thinking forever, and to salt the earth from whence it came so nothing can ever grow there again.

Romney and ANYONE who takes the "Obama is apologizing!" talking point out of this is so vile, so deceitful, and so disgusting they should have their citizenship stripped.

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