Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos: A politics thread

by **TenuredVulture** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 13:42:46

Time to restart the Schumpeter reading group again?

by **Phan In Phlorida** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 14:36:50

cshort wrote:Well, I heard my first heartwarming story about someone benefiting from the proposed unemployment benefits extension. A neighbor was proud to declare that the additional extension, along with his under the table earnings, will allow he and his family to take a trip to Disney World. Why the #$&! do I bother working.......

Did you turn him in?

by **dajafi** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 14:54:24

I don't like agreeing with Tom Friedman, but this column is pretty much the queen's teats:

At a time of nearly 10 percent unemployment in America, we have the Israelis and the Palestinians sitting over there with their arms folded, waiting for more U.S. assurances or money to persuade them to do what is manifestly in their own interest: negotiate a two-state deal. Shame on them, and shame us. You can’t want peace more than the parties themselves, and that is exactly where America is today. The people running Israel and Palestine have other priorities. It is time we left them alone to pursue them — and to live with the consequences.
...
I understand the problem: Israeli and Palestinian leaders cannot end the conflict between each other without having a civil war within their respective communities. Netanyahu would have to take on the settlers and Abbas would have to take on Hamas and the Fatah radicals. Both men have silent majorities that would back them if they did, but neither man feels so uncomfortable with his present situation to risk that civil war inside to make peace outside. There are no Abe Lincolns out there.

What this means, argues the Hebrew University philosopher Moshe Halbertal, is that the window for a two-state solution is rapidly closing. Israel will end up permanently occupying the West Bank with its 2.5 million Palestinians. We will have a one-state solution. Israel will have inside its belly 2.5 million Palestinians without the rights of citizenship, along with 1.5 million Israeli Arabs. “Then the only question will be what will be the nature of this one state — it will either be apartheid or Lebanon,” said Halbertal. “We will be confronted by two horrors.”

The most valuable thing that President Obama and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton could do now is just get out of the picture — so both leaders and both peoples have an unimpeded view of their horrible future together in one state, if they can’t separate.

by **cshort** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 15:07:09

Phan In Phlorida wrote:
cshort wrote:Well, I heard my first heartwarming story about someone benefiting from the proposed unemployment benefits extension. A neighbor was proud to declare that the additional extension, along with his under the table earnings, will allow he and his family to take a trip to Disney World. Why the #$&! do I bother working.......

Did you turn him in?

No, I actually feel bad for his kid, and wouldn't do that to a 2 year-old.

And Doc, give me a frggin break. This clown lost his job by calling out sick, not showing up for work, and trying to claim disability. It had nothing to do with a bad economy.

I have no problem having my taxes used to help those less fortunate. I also know a young lady who has been essentially parentless since her early teens. She is working her way through college, takes loans, and busts her ass. I'm happy to have my taxes raised to help people like her out (and by the way, I have chipped in, having only known her after a year or so). I have a problem with a system that is too easy to manipulate, and that has far too much fraud and abuse. And that abuse comes from both corporations and citizens.

by **jerseyhoya** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 15:28:43

So the guy only succeeded in killing himself

I always get confused when news reports say one killed in a suicide bombing, I mean, killing yourself shouldn't count in the total

by **drsmooth** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 15:33:02

cshort wrote:
Phan In Phlorida wrote:
cshort wrote:Well, I heard my first heartwarming story about someone benefiting from the proposed unemployment benefits extension. A neighbor was proud to declare that the additional extension, along with his under the table earnings, will allow he and his family to take a trip to Disney World. Why the #$&! do I bother working.......

Did you turn him in?

No, I actually feel bad for his kid, and wouldn't do that to a 2 year-old.

And Doc, give me a frggin break. This clown lost his job by calling out sick, not showing up for work, and trying to claim disability. It had nothing to do with a bad economy.

I have no problem having my taxes used to help those less fortunate. I also know a young lady who has been essentially parentless since her early teens. She is working her way through college, takes loans, and busts her ass. I'm happy to have my taxes raised to help people like her out (and by the way, I have chipped in, having only known her after a year or so). I have a problem with a system that is too easy to manipulate, and that has far too much fraud and abuse. And that abuse comes from both corporations and citizens.

so you're still obsessing about the transgressions of the person(s) most like you then

by **drsmooth** » Sun Dec 12, 2010 15:33:32

TenuredVulture wrote:Time to restart the Schumpeter reading group again?

z'ackly

by **Woody** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:38:41

http://dilbert.com/blog/entry/wiki_ignorance_test/

I often get into political debates in which one of the participants is ignorant of the basic facts. Worse yet, that ignorant person is usually me. Oh, and it's usually the other person too. We think we're entitled to our opinions, but we probably aren't.

.........

The second thing I'd like to see is the television media labeling pundits in real time. That sort of interview might go like this:

Media: How would you balance the budget?

Politician: I would cut spending.

Media: What part of the budget would you cut to balance the budget?

Politician: I would cut the pork.

Media: If you think that's enough, you're either a liar or an idiot. Can you clarify which one you are?

Politician: I am insulted by that question!

Media: If you understood the question that rules out "idiot."

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 14:35:14

District Court in VA rules individual mandate unconstitutional

This gon be a hell of a Supreme Court controversy once it gets there

by **cshort** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 14:50:22

drsmooth wrote:so you're still obsessing about the transgressions of the person(s) most like you then

Whatever - that makes absolutely no sense

by **Phan In Phlorida** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 15:22:09

jerseyhoya wrote:District Court in VA rules individual mandate unconstitutional

Holy !@#$, they outlawed fapping!

by **drsmooth** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:10:01

cshort wrote:
drsmooth wrote:so you're still obsessing about the transgressions of the person(s) most like you then

Whatever - that makes absolutely no sense

I agree that your tendency to find greater fault with your neighbor than with someone more like Mark Madoff or his neighbors makes absolutely no sense

by **drsmooth** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:11:12

Phan In Phlorida wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:District Court in VA rules individual mandate unconstitutional

Holy !@#$, they outlawed fapping!

There's a Philadelphia sports connection in the case:

NYTimes wrote:Judge Hudson, who previously was best known for sentencing the N.F.L. quarterback Michael Vick to 23 months for dog fighting, had telegraphed his leanings in a series of hearings and preliminary opinions.

by **drsmooth** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:12:01

jerseyhoya wrote:District Court in VA rules individual mandate unconstitutional

This gon be a hell of a Supreme Court controversy once it gets there

About the time you need your first major heart/liver transplant

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:31:35

drsmooth wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:District Court in VA rules individual mandate unconstitutional

This gon be a hell of a Supreme Court controversy once it gets there

About the time you need your first major heart/liver transplant

I would like to think I'm not going to need a heart or liver transplant in the next year or two.

by **Barry Jive** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:47:18

Chipotle and Evan Williams beg to differ

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:48:30

Barry Jive wrote:Chipotle and Evan Williams beg to differ

They've both assured me my lifestyle choices are healthy

by **drsmooth** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 16:55:33

jerseyhoya wrote:
drsmooth wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:District Court in VA rules individual mandate unconstitutional

This gon be a hell of a Supreme Court controversy once it gets there

About the time you need your first major heart/liver transplant

I would like to think I'm not going to need a heart or liver transplant in the next year or two.

You think the Sup Ct is going to get to this as early as next year?

HAhaa

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 17:02:09

We're up to three district court rulings on this - two for the individual mandate and one opposing. It will reach the circuit level soon, and if there's disagreement between the circuits, the Supreme Court will take it up next term.

by **Wizlah** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 18:17:47

pacino wrote:am i crazy? wiz, why are the libs going explicitly against their campaign ideas over in crazy old england? wtf? though, of course it's the tories to truly blame, but the libs are in their pocket a bit

Forgot to reply for this.

LibDems stuck their neck out on tuition fees during the election, neither the tories nor labour were going to do the same because they knew that they'd have to go back on their word.

There's an extensive agreement about what the coalition will and won't do, and in a lot of cases (like replacing trident, I believe, although that's been put on the long finger because it's too expensive), individual libdem mps have the opportunity to abstein from a vote or vote as they wish. Which is what happened here. the folk who voted with the conservatives were all cabinet ministers of one form or another. a lot of the party voted against it.

Whatever. I don't really give a damn what happens to them so long as they get the alternate vote system through parliament. It's the only reason I voted for them. Well, that and the fact that I despise Labor and what they've done in the past 10 years. It's not single transferable vote, but it's better than first past the post, and it's what the political culture in the UK needs. If Clegg was savy, he'd be making cameron share more of the pain. Doesn't look like he's up for that.

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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos: A politics thread