VoxOrion wrote:

Barry Jive wrote:But with music, I can't accept that it's subjective. Well, it is, inherently, but so is everything in the universe worth arguing about. Music, however, has this near-impossible-to-find thread of objectivity running through it, and it's the Holy Grail of music evaluation.

The key distinction is that there is no moral question when discussing music (unless one is a total bore and tries to shoehorn one in). I can accept that musical taste is both subjective and that there may be certain quantifiable truths about it, but it's not the same. There's no contradiction like there is with the moral absolutist or the moral relativist (who in the end is not a moral relativist because to assert the very premise is asserting a kind of moral absolute).

I suppose you're right. I guess "objectivity" wasn't the correct term there.

Also, 2 Live Crew is awful but I think they're one of the most ground-breaking artists of my lifetime if only because they changed the sociopolitical landscape of the industry with their lyrics. No one else has ever done that, shaking things up from the inside. Sure, people had thrown up flags over subversion before, but no one pushed the envelope so far as to force the federal judicial branch to intervene in the proceedings.

Plus, I'm pretty unaffected by "offensive" content in any medium, but 2 Live Crew might be the only "art" that makes me blush.

Would one of you mind elaborating on why music isn't always subjective? What aspect of music is quantifiable in a way that is consistent to each and every person?

Generally speaking, no two people hear the same clip of music the same way. Some people hear emo music and just hear whining and bawling; others hear beautiful artistry of the vocal cords.

You can say that hitting some really high notes makes one a great singer but how can you prove that? One might say that musical complexity beats simple music... but it's not provable.

I just don't see an aspect of music that isn't subjective.

All you have to do is pick up an instrument you don't know how to play, try and play it, and you'll have the easiest example of objectivity in music. One can take the "Make a joyful noise" thing too far.

ReadingPhilly wrote:

my cousin mose wrote:i think we're there. let's $#@! party soon

mose when you come up i'll meet you at the millmont

HOLY SHIT!!!!

my cousin mose wrote:

ReadingPhilly wrote:

my cousin mose wrote:i think we're there. let's $#@! party soon

mose when you come up i'll meet you at the millmont

HOLY $#@!!!!!

it's called the lookout now but it will always be the millmont to me

F THAT LOOKOUT SCHMOOK OUT

VoxOrion wrote:All you have to do is pick up an instrument you don't know how to play, try and play it, and you'll have the easiest example of objectivity in music. One can take the "Make a joyful noise" thing too far.

That's the general analogy I always make, but usually I talk about a child playing the violin. If an 8-year-old goes and plays "Mary Had a Little Lamb" in front of a crowd of 20 people, is it good music? Probably not. But to that kid's parents, it's like a symphony.

my cousin mose wrote:F THAT LOOKOUT SCHMOOK OUT

agree

oh man this is craziness!
What is going on here?

but seriously, RP, i had no idea. My buddie's mom back in college used to own the joint (or so i thought). i really wish i was still 21 in PA again

VoxOrion wrote:All you have to do is pick up an instrument you don't know how to play, try and play it, and you'll have the easiest example of objectivity in music. One can take the "Make a joyful noise" thing too far.

That is subjective, though. We are socialized to believe that certain arrangements of sounds are pleasing, while others (like random strumming by a guitar newbie) are not.

This bird you cannot change!

I got 15/16 games right. It's all downhill from here.

CrashburnAlley wrote:

VoxOrion wrote:All you have to do is pick up an instrument you don't know how to play, try and play it, and you'll have the easiest example of objectivity in music. One can take the "Make a joyful noise" thing too far.

That is subjective, though. We are socialized to believe that certain arrangements of sounds are pleasing, while others (like random strumming by a guitar newbie) are not.

It's not subjective. You're taking relativism to a "socialized" degree that is nonsensical.

WilliamC wrote:We've got a palindrome somewhere

go hang a salami im a lasagna hog

Werthless wrote:Personally, I don't listen to much music. I listen to books on tapes and political speeches for fun. But usually when I drive, I just sit in silent contemplation.

Political speeches = fun :?: :?:

Phan In Phlorida wrote:

Werthless wrote:Personally, I don't listen to much music. I listen to books on tapes and political speeches for fun. But usually when I drive, I just sit in silent contemplation.

Political speeches = fun :?: :?:

He's being sarcastic. I hope.

Slowhand wrote:

WilliamC wrote:We've got a palindrome somewhere

go hang a salami im a lasagna hog

My life might be complete now.

dajafi wrote:Tim Geithner

(img)

is more then four years older than

J Mascis



For the record: I'm stone cold sober. But this makes ABSOLUTELY NO $#@! SENSE TO ME.

Jeebuz, I'm 43 and Mascis looks 10+ years older than me. I know firsthand that life on the road is a hard life, but jeez.

i need advice on my divorce dilemma. comment on that shit