jerseyhoya wrote:In the end though, elections really interest me. Public policy debates don't. I'm better informed than 99% of people. I don't have despair over what I do for a living.

I must say, I find these remarks terribly troubling. You seem like a well intended chap, but you run down a littany of backwards views with no support and then call yourself informed more than 99%? A person that informed unlikely would hold those views. but forget that -- Public Policy debates don't interest you, just the election as - competitive sport? So form over content, image over substance? I don't get it...??

How can you say you're more informed than most then ONE POST later wonder how someone can claim they're more informed than 99%?

philliesphhan wrote:How can you say you're more informed than most then ONE POST later wonder how someone can claim they're more informed than 99%?

I'm not gonna get in to a pissing match with anyone here. But I'll put my knowledge base up against anyone on this board.

You don't find it peculiar that someone would say, (paraphrase) "i'm in to elections, not policy" ?? Implies to me no real care for the issues. Just the outcome of elections.

Obama's blasting Bruce, gotta love that.

Philly the Kid wrote:

jerseyhoya wrote:In the end though, elections really interest me. Public policy debates don't. I'm better informed than 99% of people. I don't have despair over what I do for a living.

I must say, I find these remarks terribly troubling. You seem like a well intended chap, but you run down a littany of backwards views with no support and then call yourself informed more than 99%? A person that informed unlikely would hold those views. but forget that -- Public Policy debates don't interest you, just the election as - competitive sport? So form over content, image over substance? I don't get it...??

I know how backwards it is to support pragmatic fixes for Social Security, or a comprehensive energy policy overhaul, or free trade, but I've somehow come to believe in them.

Haha, look at all the white people behind Obama. And none of them wearing Abercrombie.

And Obama called Indiana for Clinton. Surely CNN can.

Philly the Kid wrote:

philliesphhan wrote:How can you say you're more informed than most then ONE POST later wonder how someone can claim they're more informed than 99%?

I'm not gonna get in to a pissing match with anyone here. But I'll put my knowledge base up against anyone on this board.

You don't find it peculiar that someone would say, (paraphrase) "i'm in to elections, not policy" ?? Implies to me no real care for the issues. Just the outcome of elections.

I didn't even comment on whether you were more knowledgeable or not, nor did I comment on how jerseyhoya gets his kicks. Your two consecutive posts were almost like

How can anyone honestly like bananas?

Boy, I love bananas.

It was almost like you didn't even read your own post is all.

philliesphhan wrote:

Philly the Kid wrote:

philliesphhan wrote:How can you say you're more informed than most then ONE POST later wonder how someone can claim they're more informed than 99%?

I'm not gonna get in to a pissing match with anyone here. But I'll put my knowledge base up against anyone on this board.

You don't find it peculiar that someone would say, (paraphrase) "i'm in to elections, not policy" ?? Implies to me no real care for the issues. Just the outcome of elections.

I didn't even comment on whether you were more knowledgeable or not, nor did I comment on how jerseyhoya gets his kicks. Your two consecutive posts were almost like

How can anyone honestly like bananas?

Boy, I love bananas.

It was almost like you didn't even read your own post is all.

ok, i can see how it came off like that...

Plus you talked about America's future running similarly to a canceled serialized drama then went on to say how knowledgeble you are.

srsly.

I'm like 98.7% sure Hillary won Indiana, but this is going to end up pretty close. And she should probably drop out. But thankfully she won't.

mpmcgraw wrote:Plus you talked about America's future running similarly to a canceled serialized drama then went on to say how knowledgeble you are.

srsly.

Here is the text of an e-mail that someone sent me -- these are NOT my views, but people out there are thinking this stuff...


===
CLUELESS MASSES: Self-explanatory

INFORMED POPULATION: These folks are PO aware, but have not yet
accepted the reality.

TECHNO FIX: These folks are PO aware, but either do not understand the
ramifications or are simply unwilling to really accept the reality of
PO. They have faith that "someone" will fix the problem for them

THE DESPAIRING: Here we have PO aware individuals who are either
incapable of forming and acting out a plan (any plan) to help them and
their loved ones survive, or are religious folks who are more
concerned with saving their souls, or are simply so deeply pessimistic
they see no sense in even attempting to prepare.

INACTIVE PREPARERS: Likely the largest group. This group has not yet
begun to prepare or is in early stages of non-committal development,
like reducing debt and exercising more. They may have a bug-out bag
or small home stockpiles. Typically, they are still trying to form an
opinion on the potential outcome and best way to prepare. Depending
on their personalities, they may have amassed large amounts of paper
knowledge and have extensive libraries -- but while they have studied
the edible plants books, they have never actually seen the plants.
They run the risk of becoming PERPETUAL PREPARERS.

ACTIVISTS: Those who have chosen not to prepare and instead focus on
social and economic change. They are often hard-crash proponents. Of
all the groups, ACTIVISTS are the most like to view Peak Oil
objectively without agrarian/militant/macho fantasies that some other
groups are prone to. ACTIVISTS may at any point migrate to one of the
early preparedness categories.

PERPETUAL PREPARERS: A state of circular thinking, where INACTIVE
PREPARERS continue to amass paper knowledge and have plans to move
ahead, but fail to act on those plans. Another candidate for the
largest group. Some of this group may be able to break out of this
thinking and begin early preparation.

WILDERNESS SURVIVALISTS: You will never see these folks on the
internet -- if you do, they are actually INACTIVE PREPARERS with macho
fantasies. However, this seems to be a dead end preparation
technique, since it involves only basic survival, has not support
group or backup plan, and is unsustainable long term without the
products of civilization. Often, even active WILDERNESS SURVIVALISTS
are prone to macho fantasies which cloud their reasoning ability about
the likely success of their chosen route. Some may migrate to the
militant preparedness path.

URBAN GARDENER: Typically a soft crash proponent. They believe in a
slow reduction of oil usage and a gradual return to a lower energy
lifestyle. Bicyclists and walkers, container gardeners, hobbiests of
anticipated high-demand post peak skills. In some cases, URBAN
GARDENERS may be hard/medium crash proponents, but are focusing their
preparation on this route as the only apparent possibility for their
situation. In a few cases, URBAN GARDENERS are pschologically
incapable of accepting a civilization without the urban surroundings
they are familiar with.

URBAN HOMESTEADER: A matured URBAN GARDENER that has transformed
their home to be as self-sustaining as possible in an urban
environment. They may have a large plot in a community garden, water
catchment systems, PV arrays, back-up heating methods and highly-
insulated homes.

NEW AGRARIANS: An early preparer along the Agrarian preparedness
path. Agrarians may be soft, middle or hard crash proponents. At
this point, NEW AGRARIANS have purchased land and a home and are
gardening or otherwise begin to produce their own food and goods.
Quite likely they are still actively involved in the oil economy by
holding jobs or living off retirement or saved money or investments.
At this point in their development, they are still highly dependent on
outside resources and are vulnerable to economic and social upheaval.
Many NEW AGRARIANS are carrying a lot of ideological baggage in the
form of veganism or extreme environmentalism, and this would include
eco-communities and other ideologically based groups.

MIDDLE AGRARIANS: A matured AGRARIAN. They have achieved a basic
level of sustainability and although they are probably still somewhat
dependent on the wider economy, they are more likely to survive
economic and social upheaval. They have left behind any unusable
ideological baggage they may have had, although their ideology
probably has colored and shaped their development of their land. They
have formed or successfully joined networks with the neighbors and in
the community for future trade and mutual support and are extending
their knowledge from basic know-how to internalizing the knowledge to
best succeed given their resources. Additionally, they are extending
their knowledge base into other areas and have achieved a journeyman
level in at least one other non-agricultural, post-peak demand skill.

AMMO STOCKPILER: An early stage along the Militant preparedness
path. Militants are exclusively hard crash proponents, usually to an
extreme. In early stages have little to offer themselves for survival
other than a stockpile of weapons and ammo, which often have little
experience and proficiency with. AMMO STOCKPILERS may also have
stockpiles of other supplies. Only a small percentage of AMMO
STOCKPILERS move on to become more mature Militants.

FORTIFIED HOMESTEADER: A more mature step another the Militant
preparedness path, FORTIFIED HOMESTEADERS have achieved at least a
journeyman level of proficiency with their weaponry and have moved on
to create a highly secure home which has significant food production
and/or tradable items and skills. The FORTIFIED HOMESTEADER is
usually not interested in achieving any kind of self-sustainability,
and may be expecting to survive in a new post-peak world as a
mercenary, parasite, or by absorbing the resources of less-successful
neighbors to acquire the additional items they need.

PEAK OIL SURVIVOR: Someone who has successfully mastered the skills
required to survive any post peak scenario. The Holy Grail of
preparedness and highly debatable.

jerseyhoya wrote:I'm like 98.7% sure Hillary won Indiana, but this is going to end up pretty close. And she should probably drop out. But thankfully she won't.

CNN has it down to 4% with 0% reporting from Lake County (Gary) and neighboring LaPorte County. Two other northern Indiana counties, St Josephs (Notre Dame) and Elkhart are fully reported and are Obama victories in places that Clinton probably was expected to win. That FiveThirtyEight.com website that dajafi had linked to had St Joe's County at Clinton +1 and Elkhart County at Clinton +10. Actual results were Obama +6 in St Joe's and Obama +18 in Elkhart! Monroe County (Univ. of Indiana) is also only at 23% reporting and Obama +34. Probably too small of a sample size, but still a sizeable difference.

Like you said, Clinton's probably going to win, but it's going to be very, very close. Too close for her liking.

Macho Row wrote:

jerseyhoya wrote:I'm like 98.7% sure Hillary won Indiana, but this is going to end up pretty close. And she should probably drop out. But thankfully she won't.

CNN has it down to 4% with 0% reporting from Lake County (Gary) and neighboring LaPorte County. Two other northern Indiana counties, St Josephs (Notre Dame) and Elkhart are fully reported and are Obama victories in places that Clinton probably was expected to win. That FiveThirtyEight.com website that dajafi had linked to had St Joe's County at Clinton +1 and Elkhart County at Clinton +10. Actual results were Obama +6 in St Joe's and Obama +18 in Elkhart! Monroe County (Univ. of Indiana) is also only at 23% reporting and Obama +34. Probably too small of a sample size, but still a sizeable difference.

Like you said, Clinton's probably going to win, but it's going to be very, very close. Too close for her liking.

Yeah, I'm looking at that. Thing is, he's still down 44,000 votes, so for all of the gap closing he's doing in the %, he has picked up 11,000 votes in the last 55 minutes. Indianapolis (Marion) is more in than the state as a percentage. Ft. Wayne is in. Basically, Gary would need to absurdly kick ass for him. Not out of the question, but really unlikely.

Porter, right in between Lake and LaPorte, is tracking that 538 website pretty well, FWIW. I guess I understand why nothing is getting called, but it would be pretty nuts to close the gap completely.

Chuck Todd on MSNBC says he needs about 55% of the remaining IN vote to pull it out.

meatball wrote:Chuck Todd on MSNBC says he needs about 55% of the remaining IN vote to pull it out.

Also says that Obama's people are getting numbers from Lake County and they think they come up 10,000 to 15,000 short statewide.

If it's as close as it looks like going in to the convention, not only Super D's but what about D's flipping? Is Hilary stronger in the established DNC world -- I'd think so. I'm actually surprised how well she's done overall, I thought Obama would start to run away with the thing... gonna be very very tense summer going in to that convention.

meatball wrote:Chuck Todd on MSNBC says he needs about 55% of the remaining IN vote to pull it out.

Chuck Todd is probably my favorite national political guy. I just don't see it, but I trust him. He's also probably more sober than I am.

jerseyhoya wrote:He's also probably more sober than I am.

dude now I have to monitor ALL threads?!

Woody wrote:

jerseyhoya wrote:He's also probably more sober than I am.

dude now I have to monitor ALL threads?!

No, I'll give a full recap in the drinking thread.

I watch MSNBC just because I love hearing the voices of Tom Brokaw and Chris Matthews

MSNBC reports with 81% it's too close to call in Indiana


this guy may take this with what counties have yet to fully report...