A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby ReadingPhilly » Wed Aug 19, 2015 23:41:26

Yes

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby Titlehungry » Wed Aug 19, 2015 23:44:46

Might as well let Asher replace Harang too
Even if you get run over by a clown car and pissed on by a busload of school children, it's still your responsibility to interpret the meaning of the event and choose a response

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby 702 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 23:45:19

Had this thoughtful post typed up, sounded super fucking lame so I backtracked.


Go Phills #newera

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby Ramon Gris » Thu Aug 20, 2015 02:43:46

Is Rusty Shackleford a Phillies?

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby PhillyPhan » Thu Aug 20, 2015 06:41:13

The Crimson Cyclone wrote:A bit optimistic isn't it?


I think that's all we got left. But in all reality, yes all of those guys could be up for September 2016. Other than a veteran arm or two to stabilize the rotation and eat innings, I don't think we should touch FA for another year unless we significantly front load a deal for a young vet.

Things like Adam Morgan getting healthy and pitching well have been huge bonuses this year that we really couldn't have expected. He looks like he can stay in the rotation and if healthy I think will likely continue to improve. If he is, then you have Nola and Morgan up now, with lots of promising arms coming, including the likely #1 pick. Once we get the core re-established, you can buy quality free agents. We've seen that.

The key now will be to watch how he call-ups do in the next 2 months as we have 42 games to start sorting out what we already have in AAA and possibly some of the kids in AA.

I'm really looking forward to seeing Altherr play every day. If Sweeney is up for the long haul, I'd like to see if he can stick in CF and move Herrera back to 2B where he was supposedly very good.
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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby drsmooth » Thu Aug 20, 2015 07:48:28

Wish Franco's wrist had just been bruised
Yes, but in a double utley you can put your utley on top they other guy's utley, and you're the winner. (Swish)

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby Bucky » Thu Aug 20, 2015 07:55:11

Titlehungry wrote:Might as well let Asher replace Harang too



can't let a vet miss out on a legitimate shot for 20 losses

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby pacino » Thu Aug 20, 2015 07:58:03

True Blue LA's Dec 2014 writeup of Sweeney:
Darnell Sweeney is the player I imagine has the most divergent base of opinions by both scouts and fans alike of players on this top 20 Dodgers prospects list. Perhaps the reason may come from which side of the plate you see him hit from, as Sweeney has two distinct plate approaches depending on what side he hits from. To his credit, Sweeney has made incremental improvements at each rung on the ladder, though his development may be deemed a little slow for a college prospect. With Triple A likely looming and a crowded infield depth chart on the big league team above him, Sweeney will need to figure out soon just what type of hitter he wants to be going forward.

Sweeney’s offense is almost worth treating each side of the plate as a two unique hitters. Against left-handers, Sweeney has a simple, quiet set-up at the plate. His swing is long but his bat speed is solid. Sweeney’s general approach from this side this year was to put the ball on the ground and run, making a lot of contact, keeping strikeouts in heck, but hitting for virtually no power. While this approach generally led to a solid average, the stat was mostly empty. My concern with his approach against left-handers is that he has to maintain a high batting average to be even somewhat useful offensively from the right side. Playing every day, you can expect teams to try to turn him around to the right side more often, and with a swing that’s still longish, he might see his strikeout rate increase from 12 percent at the big league level.

Batting from the left side, Sweeney shows the potential that tempts teams. His stat line against right-handers alone would make him appear like a budding star second baseman. There are, however, some flaws from this side as well. Sweeney takes a longer hack from the left side with more uppercut, giving him the power he displays but also bringing with it a significantly high strikeout rate. He can occasionally drop his hands from this side as well giving him worse swing plane. He displays wiry strength from this side of the plate, and puts his length to good use in his high extension. Sweeney can also get a little too rotational from the left side, but given the quality of contact he had in 2014, it hasn’t yet hampered the impact of his contact. I would almost be more curious to see how Sweeney would hit lefties from that side, whereas he may give back significantly more in average, but maybe take back gains in power.

This split in the power and long-term utility of his switch hitting would be moot if the rest of his game was more well rounded. Though he has reports suggesting he could play shortstop, the larger proof is in games played at second base. If the Dodgers believed he could be a shortstop long term, they would never have him playing as much second base as he has. Despite this, Sweeney is relatively error prone and doesn’t come across as the most instinctual player in general. Long term, he might be best served by a move to center field. While he has a reputation for being fast, Sweeney has been a subpar base-runner and contributed more harm than good last season in stolen bases. Sweeney is obviously athletic, but he has yet to allow his physical advantage to play positively into his game.

Thus far, this rundown may seem overly critical, but Sweeney has significant value because he’s managed to overcome his shortcomings to climb the ladder to the big league doorstep, carrying an .850 OPS in 2014 to boot. The biggest problem for Sweeney’s major league outlook is that the depth chart is full in front of him and he’s going to require a team that will give him time to figure out just what type of hitter he wants to be at the big league level. A team rebuilding, like Philadelphia, stands the most to gain from a player like Sweeney; where they can afford the patience of watching him strikeout at a 25-28% clip but might get the payoff of a .260/.340/.460 hitter. Someone will have to avoid the frustration of comparing what you’d expect him to be versus what he actually is. Sweeney has the upside of a poor man’s Dexter Fowler, capable of putting up a high OBP with above average slugging potential, just little in the way of speed statistics despite obvious athleticism (perhaps his most similar trait to Dex). Sweeney might be most valuable to Los Angeles in 2015 in trade, but barring that, I’d like to see him split time between second base and center fielder in hopes of making him a utility man ready to contribute in 2016, but possibly finding him a long-term niche beyond that in someone’s outfield.
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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby 702 » Thu Aug 20, 2015 08:03:46

I like Dexter Fowler

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby joe table » Thu Aug 20, 2015 08:11:42

Thanks for the info. Though i stopped taking the dudes scout writeup too seriously when he wrote that his swing "can get too rotational from the left side." The fuck is he even trying to say there. If hes talking lower body, hes an idiot. If he means he is rolling hands too early and hooking ground balls as a result, write that better breh

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby JFLNYC » Thu Aug 20, 2015 08:11:55

He cleared waivers. Maybe we can get him, too.
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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby bleh » Thu Aug 20, 2015 08:19:19

seems like Sweeney will be the most frustrating player ever.

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby PSUPhilliesPhan » Thu Aug 20, 2015 08:48:00

bleh wrote:seems like Sweeney will be the most frustrating player ever.


Dom Brown will hold that title for a decade after he's left. But yeah, it's never good when every scouting site questions baseball instincts. Chase was an 80 too if instincts could be graded.

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby Grotewold » Thu Aug 20, 2015 09:47:52

The Fowler comp feels racialist

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby pacino » Thu Aug 20, 2015 09:49:50

How bout Ryan Freel? Multi-positional utility guy that can do a few things
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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby joe table » Thu Aug 20, 2015 09:51:50

Freel was more defense-first (until the end). McDaniels threw out a Frank Catalanotto comp, bat first utility guy

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby pacino » Thu Aug 20, 2015 09:53:05

if he had Cat's career I'd take it
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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby ReadingPhilly » Thu Aug 20, 2015 09:54:21

He's pretty much cesar hermandez who can competently play the of.

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby RichmondPhilsFan » Thu Aug 20, 2015 10:36:57

Looking up Utley's WAR compared to other all-time 2B prompted me to look closer at Rogers Hornsby's numbers. Good god he was amazing.

I realize that WAR is a touchy stat when you're talking about comparing players from the early 1900s, and I realize baseball was very different back then, but even still... he put up a bWAR of 127. He played 23 seasons, so you'd think that his bWAR would be mostly due to his longevity, but it's not. He accumulated 125.2 over his first 16 seasons, and 119.7 over his first 14 seasons. By comparison, Chase Utley accumulated 61.7 over his entire 13 seasons. Hornsby put up a 9.9 bWAR season at age 21, then proceeded to put up >10 bWAR in six of the next twelve seasons. Not counting his 18-game first season, his worst season by bWAR for age 20-33 seasons was 4.4.

His 1922 season in particular is breathtakingly good, and it's not even his best season. Two particular highlight years (and they were very hard to choose):

1922: .401/.459/.752, 42 HR, 46 2B, 14 3B, 250 H, 141 R, 152 RBI, 17 SB. (10.0 WAR)

1924: .424/.507/.696, 25 HR, 43 2B, 14 3B, 227 H, 121 R, 94 RBI, 5 SB (12.1 WAR)

He lead the league in OPS eleven times (including at age 35), average seven times, HR twice, doubles four times, triples twice... you get the point. Even if we adjust his average to modern times, he'd be like what we'd get if Mike Trout or Bryce Harper played 2B and put up even better video game numbers for twelve more seasons, then still had enough left in the tank to play another seven seasons at slightly above replacement level. That's nuts.

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Re: A Final Ode to Coal Hummus and other Phillies Thoughts

Postby joe table » Thu Aug 20, 2015 13:22:22

Sandberg - Utley is an interesting career comp too. Chase's 07 where Jimmy swiped MVP was likely better than robodick's MVP season in 84. Also stacks up with any biggio peak year

Joe Gordon another good comp (both with the late prime career pauses due to war/injury). Gordon also probably the most helpful comp for his HOF candidacy (though he had an MVP to hang his hat on too)

Injuries really killed CU's career counting stats though. Though i think as baseball coverage evolves, he'll get a boost for those crazy good defense and baserunning puter numbers

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