A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gold!

Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby jerseyhoya » Thu May 22, 2014 18:56:52

SK790 wrote:what, exactly, would the negatives be? i'll have a longer post later, but just wanted clarification.

thanks for those links.

I would say the two big selling points of PR is an increase in the number of competitive parties and all (or almost all votes counting). Because of that, you see greater choice so you're going to find a party that represents your views, which usually means higher turnout and other downstream benefits. In governance you see coalitions that represent a broader segment of the population.

I don't really know how PR would work in the US given our Presidential system with separation of powers. PR usually leads to coalition governments because it's very rare for any one party to win a majority. It's hard enough getting Democrats and Republicans to compromise, but imagine if you've got a Democrat in the White House, a Republican/Libertarian coalition running the House and a Democrat/Green coalition running the Senate and trying to pass anything. Countries that have proportional representation don't have two houses of parliament that are equal in power plus a powerful executive who is chosen separately from the legislature. It's too many potential veto points for anything to ever pass. So along with the fact that we'd never pass proportional representation in the real world, other even more dramatic changes would have to take place to make it work.

Other negatives - the introduction of extremist parties into the system. Racist/fascist/communist parties can get into the legislature if they only need 2-5% of the vote to get representation.
-Instability of coalitions leading to frequent collapses of governments
-Ability of party leaders to enforce unanimity by booting disloyal members off the list
-Disconnect between the elected officials and local constituencies

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby TenuredVulture » Thu May 22, 2014 22:01:19

Be Bold!

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby td11 » Thu May 22, 2014 22:05:02

TenuredVulture wrote:Holy shit. Animals.

http://www.wapt.com/news/central-missis ... z32Td6qQF2

Don't see any male black teens in hoodies mentioned in the story though
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby The Dude » Thu May 22, 2014 22:10:18

my friends next door got their marriage license yesterday bc of the decision. i'm ordained so i'm going to offer to do it since they're going on the cheap.
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby jerseyhoya » Fri May 23, 2014 02:02:42

UKIP doing unexpectedly well in the local council elections. European parliament results come in Sunday, and on the back of this I imagine they'll be doing very well there too. Right wing Euroskeptic parties rising across Europe. UKIP seems a lot less offensive than the National Front in France and Geert Wilders party in the Netherlands, but that might be an incorrect assessment from afar. All three might actually win the most votes in their countries this weekend.

I watched the BBC coverage for about three hours tonight, and UKIP seemed to be a caricature of the worst of the Republican Party drawn up by the lefties who post here in their rare forays into the coverage. Shadow economic minister was talking about how they don't actually have a manifesto (British for platform) so any charges that their policies are bad are untrue because they don't really have policies (seriously, this was the argument...but they've got experts working the manifesto and it'll be released before next year's general election, don't you fret). There was the suggestion budget cuts could be achieved mostly through cutting foreign aid because it is a huge part of the budget. And then throwing a black guy out there to hate on people playing the race card against UKIP. All that said I'd probably vote for them in Europe (but never for anything domestically) if I lived over there because I really dislike the lack of democratic responsiveness of the EU and think sending in the clowns is the best option.

The EU elections this weekend are going to be pretty wild and worth paying attention to. In the wake of the turbulence of the past five years, the extremes on the left and right are gaining at the expense of the center. Will be interesting to see how it all shakes out.

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby drsmooth » Fri May 23, 2014 07:34:55

The Dude wrote:my friends next door got their marriage license yesterday bc of the decision. i'm ordained so i'm going to offer to do it since they're going on the cheap.



wait, wait, wait, wait, wait - we have TWO men of the cloth among our number?

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby drsmooth » Fri May 23, 2014 07:36:04

jerseyhoya wrote:Other negatives - the introduction of extremist parties into the system


"he deadpanned"
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby slugsrbad » Fri May 23, 2014 08:34:29

drsmooth wrote:
The Dude wrote:my friends next door got their marriage license yesterday bc of the decision. i'm ordained so i'm going to offer to do it since they're going on the cheap.



wait, wait, wait, wait, wait - we have TWO men of the cloth among our number?

Knock me over with a salver


I assumed he was one of those interweb ministers
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby Monkeyboy » Fri May 23, 2014 10:37:43

My wife became ordained last summer so that she could do her brother's wedding. I don't think she's done a good job of brining us closer to God.
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby Bucky » Fri May 23, 2014 10:40:58

she should use a higher salt concentration in her solution

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby Luzinski's Gut » Fri May 23, 2014 11:47:39

Was working with a leading foreign policy think tank yesterday here in DC, rumor is that Shinseki is getting fired within the next 14 days.
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby pacino » Fri May 23, 2014 11:56:37

Why
thephan wrote:pacino's posting is one of the more important things revealed in weeks.

Calvinball wrote:Pacino was right.

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby drsmooth » Fri May 23, 2014 12:26:29

jerseyhoya wrote: All that said I'd probably vote for them in Europe (but never for anything domestically) if I lived over there because I really dislike the lack of democratic responsiveness of the EU and think sending in the clowns is the best option.


The clowns are the Very Serious People (looking at you mostly Germans) who decided austerity was just the tonic for the EU economies, the corrosive, reactionary results of which are now being elected into political offices all around the joint
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby Luzinski's Gut » Fri May 23, 2014 15:14:19

Hasn't been effective enough reforming a broken organization and another political scandal affecting the POTUS is not a way to succeed in DC today.

pacino wrote:Why
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby TenuredVulture » Fri May 23, 2014 15:16:07

I'm surprised he's held on this long. This isn't a fake scandal. And even if the VA has had problems for a long time, it's not like no one saw this coming.
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby pacino » Sat May 24, 2014 09:35:57

Christie has decided to shore the pension system in order to balance his budget in the short-term and de-fund the pension system in the long run. That'll work out great.
thephan wrote:pacino's posting is one of the more important things revealed in weeks.

Calvinball wrote:Pacino was right.

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby SteveJeltzPhanClub » Sat May 24, 2014 11:24:41

UCSB killer's youtube post:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbv5Vpa ... e=youtu.be

Kid is the son of the Hunger Games Asst. Director. Killed 6 confirmed at the moment in a drive-by, 7 other in critical condition. Terrible day for everyone in our community here.

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby BigEd76 » Sat May 24, 2014 17:18:10

Image

hey now

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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby drsmooth » Sat May 24, 2014 19:02:40

lookit our robot working PiP-style in the politix thred
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Re: A New Politics Thread? That's Gold Gerry(mandering); Gol

Postby Monkeyboy » Sat May 24, 2014 21:37:39

pacino wrote:Christie has decided to shore the pension system in order to balance his budget in the short-term and de-fund the pension system in the long run. That'll work out great.



Now he has his conservative bona fides for the screw-the-worker crowd. Hard to get elected from the GOP right now without showing you're willing to hurt the middle class and poor.
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