Roster Watch

by **Grotewold** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 14:31:01

FTN wrote:
Grotewold wrote:Is it true that Jaramillo is more likely to be called up 9/1 than Marson? If so, why?

The Cuz and Prof were discussing it on WIP but shed little light.

Yes.

Jaramillo is on the 40 man roster right now. Marson has to be added after the season. Adding him now and putting him on the active roster gives him 30 days of service time.

Thanks. The Prof was trying to incite a riot over the fact that the super-cheap Phillies obviously didn't want to give Marson big bucks for that extra month in 2013 if they could avoid it...

by **dajafi** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 14:35:37

I'd call them both, but I guess an argument can be made that Jaramillo is the better promotion because, one, his defense might be superior at this point (and perhaps he's worked with more of the pitchers), and two, you might be able to goose his trade value this winter with some pennant-race exposure.

by **jerseyhoya** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 14:36:43

I was really hoping when I saw this thread was bumped that we had added a pitcher for tonight.

by **FTN** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 14:37:12

The odds of Marson being a Super Two are slim

A: A player with three or more years of service, but less than six years, may file for salary arbitration. In addition, a player can be classified as a "Super Two" and be eligible for arbitration with less than three years of service. A player with at least two but less than three years of Major League service shall be eligible for salary arbitration if he has accumulated at least 86 days of service during the immediately preceding season and he ranks in the top 17 percent in total service in the class of Players who have at least two but less than three years of Major League service, however accumulated, but with at least 86 days of service accumulated during the immediately preceding season.

But Jaramillo is still ahead of him on the depth chart, even though Marson is the better long term prospect.

by **lethal** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 14:49:38

FTN wrote:The odds of Marson being a Super Two are slim

A: A player with three or more years of service, but less than six years, may file for salary arbitration. In addition, a player can be classified as a "Super Two" and be eligible for arbitration with less than three years of service. A player with at least two but less than three years of Major League service shall be eligible for salary arbitration if he has accumulated at least 86 days of service during the immediately preceding season and he ranks in the top 17 percent in total service in the class of Players who have at least two but less than three years of Major League service, however accumulated, but with at least 86 days of service accumulated during the immediately preceding season.

But Jaramillo is still ahead of him on the depth chart, even though Marson is the better long term prospect.

The cutoff for Super 2 is usually mid May or so. If Marson comes up in September, they'd just have to keep him down until mid/late June next year to avoid the Super 2 status. Either that or keep him up from the beginning and avoid Super 2 altogether and make him a FA one year earlier. I think the Ryan Howard experience might prompt them to avoid Super 2 altogether.

by **Laexile** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:10:28

Barring the Phillies being idiots, which is within the realm of possibility, how is Marson not the opening day catcher next year? If he is, then a September call up wouldn't affect free agent or arbitration status. I can't see the Phillies going into next year with Ruiz and Coste.

by **seke2** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:17:32

Cause the Phils are idiots, Laex.

And obviously, as we saw in the year where Ruiz was ready to break in, they didn't feel comfortable with a player that inexperienced being the go-to guy behind the plate, and signed Rod freaking Barajas.

I wonder what we could get for Ruiz this offseason.

by **Grotewold** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:19:37

seke2 wrote:And obviously, as we saw in the year where Ruiz was ready to break in, they didn't feel comfortable with a player that inexperienced being the go-to guy behind the plate, and signed Rod freaking Barajas.

Maybe Coste would be the odd man out in that scenario

by **FTN** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:20:25

If the Phillies were a smart organization, they'd carry 11 pitches and 14 bench players, using Coste as a pinch hitter/3rd catcher/emergency other positions player, let Marson and Ruiz split the duties until Marson settles in and then let him catch 5 days a week.

But Marson will start in AAA and likely not make his debut until next September, unless someone gets hurt.

by **smitty** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:25:08

seke2 wrote:Cause the Phils are idiots, Laex.

And obviously, as we saw in the year where Ruiz was ready to break in, they didn't feel comfortable with a player that inexperienced being the go-to guy behind the plate, and signed Rod freaking Barajas.

I wonder what we could get for Ruiz this offseason.

Barajas has an OPS + of 94 this season. He might not be such a bad guy to have had this season. The Phils seem to have a knack for getting guys in exactly the wrong year.

by **smitty** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:27:22

FTN wrote:If the Phillies were a smart organization, they'd carry 11 pitches and 14 bench players, using Coste as a pinch hitter/3rd catcher/emergency other positions player, let Marson and Ruiz split the duties until Marson settles in and then let him catch 5 days a week.

But Marson will start in AAA and likely not make his debut until next September, unless someone gets hurt.

This could be a very good barometer for how smart or dumb the Phils are. It will be interesting to see what they do. For some reason the Phils hae been very reluctant to advance catchers to the big leagues. I think you are correct in regards to what they should do.

by **dajafi** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:43:32

Eh, I don't see Manuel ever going to 11 pitchers. (Has there been a stretch of more than a few days since he took over that they've had only 11?) I agree in theory that it's the better way to go--especially lately when he's been pinch-hitting for pinch-hitters and generally getting a bit Gene Mauch-ish on our asses. But managerial comfort level seems to dictate these things.

Maybe the trick is to get a two-way guy like Kieschnick (sp?) or McCarty as the 12th arm/14th position player. Too bad Eaton sucks so bad on the mound...

by **lethal** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:46:34

dajafi wrote:Maybe the trick is to get a two-way guy like Kieschnick (sp?) or McCarty as the 12th arm/14th position player. Too bad Eaton sucks so bad on the mound...

Joe Savery

by **seke2** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:47:40

or drabek
or gose

perhaps this is the phils new strategy

by **dajafi** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:48:44

lethal wrote:
dajafi wrote:Maybe the trick is to get a two-way guy like Kieschnick (sp?) or McCarty as the 12th arm/14th position player. Too bad Eaton sucks so bad on the mound...

Joe Savery

Hmm. No doubt he'd be the pitching pinch-hitter of choice... but unless you're conferring him to the bullpen, that's a tough gig. Starters are such creatures of habit, I'd almost want him to be tuned out from the other four games as the rotation guys generally are (weird episodes like last night excepted, of course).

by **Grotewold** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 15:51:04

Am I crazy, or was there a reliever or two in particular in the 80s who could play a decent RF or LF and therefore stay in the game when another LOOGY (or ROOGY?) entered?

I was somehow reminded of that when I saw Ruiz at 3B, which just looked crazy

by **BuddyGroom** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 16:38:04

Not for us, but the Brewers used to have a reliever/pinch-hitter named Brooks Kieschnick. Unfortunately, he was pretty marginal in both roles at the major league level.

by **JFLNYC** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 17:12:44

Grotewold wrote:Am I crazy, or was there a reliever or two in particular in the 80s who could play a decent RF or LF and therefore stay in the game when another LOOGY (or ROOGY?) entered?

I was somehow reminded of that when I saw Ruiz at 3B, which just looked crazy

Gene Mauch used to do it all the time in the 60's.

by **CalvinBall** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 17:18:58

Something like that happened earlier this year too. I don't remember what team. Maybe the Pirates?

by **ReadingPhilly** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 17:26:02

CalvinBall wrote:Something like that happened earlier this year too. I don't remember what team. Maybe the Pirates?

cox did it

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