hoya wrote:Do we think the improvement in defense will overcome his offense likely being worse than Helms/Dobbs?

It's a distinct possibility, especially if you're pessimistic about Dobbs being able to repeat 2007 offensively.

Is he even any good at defense? C'mon, I desperately want to hate this move

Woody wrote:Is he even any good at defense? C'mon, I desperately want to hate this move

All the articles say he's "Gold Glove caliber"

5 straight 20+ HR yrs while playing most of his games in Pac Bell/SBC/ATT/Verizon/CokeBottle Park, he'll hit 7th or 8th depending on where they put Ruiz/Coste, he moves Helms to the bench, he can play a couple of games at 1B if necessary, he has playoff experience, and he didn't cost a draft pick. I'm OK with it...

Yuck - maybe the goal of the organization is to set the single season team HR record?

hoya wrote:Do we think the improvement in defense will overcome his offense likely being worse than Helms/Dobbs?

That and the fact that we won't have to waste Dobbs with late-inning defensive replacements by a Nunez type, which might net an extra-inning win?

Fieldingbible.com called him the best defensive third baseman in baseball last season.

scratch my back w/ a hacksaw

two thumjbs up

love it

i think in general the move doesnt make the phillies worse... just dumber.

for the reasons of yeah he has good power, yeah his obp is laughable, yeah he plays great defense, yeah maybe his loose bat will not be as exposed in a better lineup... it might be a lateral move on the field.

but now it just adds another year of having a "hole" at 3B...

i may have been getting ahead of myself but i was getting excited about the cubs aramis ramirez with josh vitters knocking on the door. or someone like that.

in anycase...

im pretty sure after the first week we will see "ARGHGHG we will only score when we hit homeruns!!!!" at least 6 times.

Could be ok I guess.

Ugh.

This blows.

serious can he be worse than wes helms?

If it's a normal salary, I'm okay with it...not happy, but not pissed.

This could be a good move.

1) They go from two of the worst defensive third basemen, Dobbs and Helms, to one of the best.

2) Charlie gave 212 ABs to Abe Nunez as a 3B last year with Dobbs and Helms playing there. There's no reason to think Charlie wouldn't have given the same number of ABs to Eric Brunlett this year. Bruntlett is a horrible hitter and not that good a fielder. So there alone this is an upgrade.

3) Based on park effect and the 19% bump in walks Phillies' players had last year he'd increase by three singles, a triple, five homers, and six walks, while going down five doubles. That would raise him from .250/.290/.415 to .261/.309/.451 and a .760 OPS.

4) New players had a 54% bump in walks. Rod Barajas went from one walk every 19.7 plate appearances to one walk every 6. Feliz is in Barajas class. Feliz's biggest weakness, walks, is the thing Milt and Charlie usually help players with. Players who are undervalued due to a lack of walks can have more value to the Phillies as a result.

I like it. I am sure that Helms and Dobbs would cost at least a few games with their defense. And I can't resist the 20 hr/yr. I was really hoping this would happen when the rumor was mentioned.

http://www.pedrofeliz.com/

He has his own website, so he must be good

Laexile wrote:This could be a good move.

1) They go from two of the worst defensive third basemen, Dobbs and Helms, to one of the best.

2) Charlie gave 212 ABs to Abe Nunez as a 3B last year with Dobbs and Helms playing there. There's no reason to think Charlie wouldn't have given the same number of ABs to Eric Brunlett this year. Bruntlett is a horrible hitter and not that good a fielder. So there alone this is an upgrade.

3) Based on park effect and the 19% bump in walks Phillies' players had last year he'd increase by three singles, a triple, five homers, and six walks, while going down five doubles. That would raise him from .250/.290/.415 to .261/.309/.451 and a .760 OPS.

4) New players had a 54% bump in walks. Rod Barajas went from one walk every 19.7 plate appearances to one walk every 6. Feliz is in Barajas class. Feliz's biggest weakness, walks, is the thing Milt and Charlie usually help players with. Players who are undervalued due to a lack of walks can have more value to the Phillies as a result.

those reasons are kinda fun...

i agree with them, this COULD be good.

but... i just wish it were for 1 year, that's all.

I think it smells like feet mostly because I wanted something that was really interesting or even a big shove to the offense. The fact is that the team's infield should be above average a first, second and short on offense, above average at second, short and third on defense. The late in the lineup wild card of Filez laying into one will be interesting, and if he is hitting in the 7/8 hole I can shrug it off.

This could be a truly pretty good move if Feliz is a top of league defender and fits in with team chemistry of the team/infield timing. Helms, Dobbs and others at third last season only made me scream at my TV. The defense was more annoying then the terrible stats, and the inconsistent offensive production was equally maddening.

Over all this deal just tastes like expensive water to me, nothing remarkable.

could the Marlins still want Helms with Cantu? We can hope.

I like it when infielders get lots of homers.