thephan wrote:I thought it fairly spot on In a piece I skimmed yesterday that said the Democrats have managed to find a potential candidate as divisive as Trump in Bernie.

I guess? He is gaining the majority of support of almost any group you can name demographically. And if not he's pretty darn close.

IDK, I'm kind of warming to the candidate with conviction who's right about everything

Recognizing that I'm not a Sanders supporter, the one logic that is escaping me is that somehow Bernie hurts down ballot races? I don't even get the theory behind that? That his supporters hate the Dem establishment so much that they would turn out and ONLY vote for Sanders?

Squire wrote:Recognizing that I'm not a Sanders supporter, the one logic that is escaping me is that somehow Bernie hurts down ballot races? I don't even get the theory behind that? That his supporters hate the Dem establishment so much that they would turn out and ONLY vote for Sanders?

The concern is that DNC types will hold their nose and vote for Bernie, but then vote GOP down ballot to ensure he doesn’t achieve any legislative success. I think this fear is based on emotion, rather than evidence.

Especially in these divisive times I don’t see many Dems voting for anyone with an (R) next to their name.

Bernie would be wise to remind voters that this election is largely about preserving RBG’s seat and underscore how crucial having the majority in the Senate will be to ensure his nominee to fill her spot is approved.

It's very odd that Carville came back from the dead in the first place. And now it's gross MSNBC keeps trotting him out there in hopes he will become rabid again and go viral.

Hurts down ballot because he won't gotv. So if he loses the down ballots are gonna all lose.

If he wins then down ballots will do well. It's all just couched in the premise that he's going to lose and not turn out voters.

So Bernie wins, it’s because of Russia. Meaning trump either does not leave office or leaves but then spends next 4 years doing exactly what was just done to him.

Trump wins, he did it despite Russia helping Bernie. He’s further vindicated.

Putin wins.

Also, brokered convention drives further wedge in Dems with Bernie bros either not voting or going 3rd party. Trump then wins.

Putin wins.

You're a real Debbie Downer.

How about this:

Bernie wins in November and Dems take control of the Senate.

Democracy and common decency wins.

Warszawa wrote:

pacino wrote:if the moderates want to prevent Bernie from winning the entire thing, they'd actually get together and decide who of them will be left. but they won't so Bernie will win! After Super Tuesday this thing is OVAH

At the very least klobuchar and stier need to go

If Bernie doesn’t get the required number of delegates he won’t be the nominee

He will if he has a commanding plurality.

06hawkalum wrote:You're a real Debbie Downer.

How about this:

Bernie wins in November and Dems take control of the Senate.

Democracy and common decency wins.

Dream big.

Squire wrote:Recognizing that I'm not a Sanders supporter, the one logic that is escaping me is that somehow Bernie hurts down ballot races? I don't even get the theory behind that? That his supporters hate the Dem establishment so much that they would turn out and ONLY vote for Sanders?

I think the theory is Sanders has relative strengths and weaknesses vs. a generic Democrat, and where he is relatively weak are places the Democrats have vulnerability on the House side and where most of the opportunities are on the Senate side.

He is stronger among young voters so may run up the score in cities and may be better positioned than some to win Obama/Trump voters in more rural or white working class areas. But is likely to be weaker among the upper middle class suburban swing voter type where the Democrats built their House majority in 2018. A lot of freshmen represent districts that were very close in 2016, so the fear is if Trump is winning their suburban districts by more than a point or two, he'll pull the Republican challenger along with him.

Also regionally in the country I think there's a presumption he'll do better in the rust belt Pennsylvania to Wisconsin stretch that's important to the electoral college, but less so to the Senate map this year. And there's a presumption he'll be relatively weaker in the sun belt, which is where more of the potential Dem takeovers are (NC, GA x2, AZ) that they'll need if they want a majority.

Conventional wisdom has not batted 1.000 over the past five years so maybe his actual performance won't match it, but that's the theory.

Anecdotal but a friend in VA, who votes on Super Tuesday, was thinking Pete but now is going to vote for Sanders because he wants the party to get behind someone and move towards November.

does Nevada no longer count as the Sun Belt

Strength in low turnout partisan contests aren't representative of general election performance.

Hillary Clinton's 4 highest vote shares in the primary were: Mississippi, DC, Alabama and Louisiana

Donald Trump's 4 highest vote shares in the primary (before everyone dropped out) were: Rhode Island, Delaware, New York, and Connecticut

Grotewold wrote:IDK, I'm kind of warming to the candidate with conviction who's right about everything

The funny thing is that most ppl’s objections to sanders are usually about his personality (too loud, rude, antagonistic), that his supporters online are too mean, and that he’ll never get anything through the republican held senate. It is rarely the case that the person actually disagrees with things like universal healthcare, free college, taxing billionaires. At least that’s my sense of it

Also, msnbc needs to put Chris Matthews and Nicole wallace on suicide watch. They were irate and downright depressed on tv all evening yesterday

td11 wrote:

Grotewold wrote:IDK, I'm kind of warming to the candidate with conviction who's right about everything

The funny thing is that most ppl’s objections to sanders are usually about his personality (too loud, rude, antagonistic), that his supporters online are too mean, and that he’ll never get anything through the republican held senate. It is rarely the case that the person actually disagrees with things like universal healthcare, free college, taxing billionaires. At least that’s my sense of it

And that’s with 25 years of the Democrats cowering in the corner when Rush or O’Reilly or whoever screamed Class Warfare.

I refuse to accept Bernie’s policies — actually expressed clearly and widely — are a loser across the masses. Let’s maybe try.

CalvinBall wrote:Anecdotal but a friend in VA, who votes on Super Tuesday, was thinking Pete but now is going to vote for Sanders because he wants the party to get behind someone and move towards November.

It's pretty wild that there are very few signs out, I am talking less then a handful on two regular runs down two highways about 12miles each direction.

I cannot vote as an independent, but there is an on your honor about crossing party lines. I know a few died in the wool Trumpeters that have said they are voting for Bernie because he is ready pickins for Don in the general.

td11 wrote:It is rarely the case that the person actually disagrees with things like universal healthcare, free college, taxing billionaires. At least that’s my sense of it

I mean, as concepts in a vacuum, of course nobody is going to disagree. It's how these things are paid for that folks disagree with.

06hawkalum wrote:

Squire wrote:Recognizing that I'm not a Sanders supporter, the one logic that is escaping me is that somehow Bernie hurts down ballot races? I don't even get the theory behind that? That his supporters hate the Dem establishment so much that they would turn out and ONLY vote for Sanders?

The concern is that DNC types will hold their nose and vote for Bernie, but then vote GOP down ballot to ensure he doesn’t achieve any legislative success. I think this fear is based on emotion, rather than evidence.

Especially in these divisive times I don’t see many Dems voting for anyone with an (R) next to their name.

Bernie would be wise to remind voters that this election is largely about preserving RBG’s seat and underscore how crucial having the majority in the Senate will be to ensure his nominee to fill her spot is approved.

a sanders nomination is a mcsally victory here in az. probably her only chance to win, to be honest.