World Series 2009 Game 4 Thread: TONIGHT IS OUR NIGHT

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:19:38

EndlessSummer wrote:
CalvinBall wrote:Honestly we got a lot of $#@! luck tonight. Two critical bloop hits and a grounder that Jimmy normally gets playing his regular spot.

I am more heartbroken and sad than anything. It is hard to be angry at this team. They are great. No matter what happens the rest of the series we are lucky to have such a lovable bunch of guys to root for. We could be cheering for players like A-Rod, Swisher, Posada, and Damon. Guys that just don't seem like enjoyable people. Victorino, Howard, Utley, Rollins, Ruiz, Lee, Werth, and the rest of them are awesome. Every single one of them. Be proud of your team.

Should Lidge have been in there? I don't know. He got two outs. Almost had a third and weird crap starting happening.

We still have at least one more game with one of the best pitchers in the league throwing for us. This thing is not over. It is going to be hard but it is not over.

This is actually a great post.

Yah, I give Calvin shit sometimes, but that's good stuff.

by **BigEd76** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:25:30

A-Rod and these f'ing sweaters

by **bleh** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:25:43

jerseyhoya wrote:
bleh wrote:
pianopop9 wrote:not a single $#@! reporter asked cholly why he went to lidge in the 9th.

I don't remember anyone objecting to it in this thread...

I mean before he gave up the 3 runs :lol:

You could argue that he should have pulled him at some point, but I thought the consensus was he was seemingly "fixed" and it was ok to use him. Usually when Charlie does something like use Bruntlett people yell about it but I don't think anyone said that at the time about Lidge before he went in. Maybe I missed it though. So I don't blame Charlie for using him here. It just sucks that he blew it.

by **BigEd76** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:26:45

ha CSN cuts away as soon as a reporter starts talking in Spanish

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:26:47

bleh, you should reread the thread then if you don't think anyone was objecting to it.

by **Bucky** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:27:23

And why didn't Pedro chase Damon??? Is it that much of a mismatch??

by **bleh** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:27:33

I think I'll take your word for it

by **Monkeyboy** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:28:10

Slowhand wrote:
Bucky wrote:
BigEd76 wrote:
Slowhand wrote:
BigEd76 wrote:Charlie blaming Ruiz and Lidge for that blown cover of 3rd

what'd he say?

He was asked whose fault it was and Charlie said that's normally the catcher's job, or the pitcher....

that's a lazy BS answer. Obviously they hadn't thought about that situation or discussed it because he would have had a singular answer. regardless, either way it's almost a physical impossibility, unless they work on a play with the pitcher breaking to third immediately upon knowing the runner is going. Which obviously has never before been seen in the history of baseball.

Yeah, realistically there was little chance either one of them would have been able to cover the bag. It's also a dumb thing to be pissed off about because Damon still scores from second.

I can see why it might be hard for Ruiz because he has to release the ball to 2B before running 90 feet to 3B, but Lidge should have no trouble getting the 64 feet to 3B ffrom the pitcher's mound when he could leave as soon as he saw damon going to 2B. Afterall, he doesn't need to get there, he just needs to get close enough to keep Damon from taking the base. I suspect Charlie was mad because he knew it was someone's responsibility. He's just protecting the person who had the responsibility.

But I'd like to see his PC, or at least hear why people said he sounded pissed. What did he say that sounded pissed?

by **drsmooth** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:28:35

Uncle Milty wrote:
BigEd76 wrote:These highlights are painful

Precisely the reason I'm watching 3:10 to Yuma

remake or the original?

by **SideshowBob** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:30:29

Question about the Damon to third play... why don't the Phillies have Rollins cover 2B in that situation. I mean, I know you tend to cover with the SS (whee Feliz was essentially playing) with a lefty up, but why wouldn't you use the SS to cover 2B since you'd actually be opening up a smaller hole on the right side of the infield by using him (considering the 2B and 1B were over there) and you'd prevent precisely that sort of crap move that occured by having Feliz in front of the runner.

Does anyone know what other teams do when Howard is up for us if someone steals?

by **BigEd76** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:31:48

Lidge interview in the locker room

"Hopefully Cliff will give us a good game tomorrow and get us back to New York."

"I don't know who was supposed to cover third there....he's faster than I am....heads-up player...."

by **CalvinBall** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:32:41

SideshowBob wrote:Question about the Damon to third play... why don't the Phillies have Rollins cover 2B in that situation. I mean, I know you tend to cover with the SS (whee Feliz was essentially playing) with a lefty up, but why wouldn't you use the SS to cover 2B since you'd actually be opening up a smaller hole on the right side of the infield by using him (considering the 2B and 1B were over there) and you'd prevent precisely that sort of crap move that occured by having Feliz in front of the runner.

Does anyone know what other teams do when Howard is up for us if someone steals?

Rollins was pretty far from the bag and deep in the infield. I don't know. I just don't think Lidge has probably had to deal with that situation and everyone was caught a bit off guard.

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:32:53

For bleh

Monkeyboy wrote:I think I'd leave madson in. Lidge has been bad with coming into tie games. And maddog looked good last inning.

Trent Steele wrote:so, eh. lidge is pitching here

can we use happ instead?

jerseyhoya wrote:
hoya wrote:Please leave Madson in

PSUsarge wrote:
uncle milt wrote:
hoya wrote:Please leave Madson in

this

with you guys.

dajafi wrote:
hoya wrote:Please leave Madson in

Not gonna happen. And he did throw a lot of pitches.

How about this: have someone up immediately, go to Eyre if, g-d forbid, it gets to Damon.

by **BigEd76** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:33:39

Brad is way too confident in this interview

by **Monkeyboy** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:34:15

BigEd76 wrote:Lidge interview in the locker room

"Hopefully Cliff will give us a good game tomorrow and get us back to New York."

"I don't know who was supposed to cover third there....he's faster than I am....heads-up player...."

so damon can run the 2nd half of the leg to 2B, slide, get up and read the play, then run the whole way to 3B..... all before Lidge can run the 64 feet to 3B.

Yeh, that's BS.

by **CalvinBall** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:35:13

BigEd76 wrote:Brad is way too confident in this interview

would you prefer him to give up like cole?

by **Bucky** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:35:31

Monkeyboy wrote:
Slowhand wrote:
Bucky wrote:
BigEd76 wrote:
Slowhand wrote:
BigEd76 wrote:Charlie blaming Ruiz and Lidge for that blown cover of 3rd

what'd he say?

He was asked whose fault it was and Charlie said that's normally the catcher's job, or the pitcher....

that's a lazy BS answer. Obviously they hadn't thought about that situation or discussed it because he would have had a singular answer. regardless, either way it's almost a physical impossibility, unless they work on a play with the pitcher breaking to third immediately upon knowing the runner is going. Which obviously has never before been seen in the history of baseball.

Yeah, realistically there was little chance either one of them would have been able to cover the bag. It's also a dumb thing to be pissed off about because Damon still scores from second.

I can see why it might be hard for Ruiz because he has to release the ball to 2B before running 90 feet to 3B, but Lidge should have no trouble getting the 64 feet to 3B ffrom the pitcher's mound when he could leave as soon as he saw damon going to 2B. Afterall, he doesn't need to get there, he just needs to get close enough to keep Damon from taking the base. I suspect Charlie was mad because he knew it was someone's responsibility. He's just protecting the person who had the responsibility.

But I'd like to see his PC, or at least hear why people said he sounded pissed. What did he say that sounded pissed?

no, two things wrong with that. #1, many pitchers (lidge among them) need recovery time after a pitch in order to turn into a fielder. #2, this is such a rare circumstance- shift on, runner stealing, throw to 2nd "behind" the runner (or bobbled I guess would be the more likely scenario) that is has never been defensed before. Has anyone ever seen a pitcher break for third on a play like this? We've seen our share with RyHo and even occassionaly Chase. But I've never seen defensive anticipation of a play at third. I'll eat my words if I hear a Phillie say they talked about doing that, but I'm pretty sure I won't have to.

by **swishnicholson** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:36:31

BigEd76 wrote:Lidge interview in the locker room

"Hopefully Cliff will give us a good game tomorrow and get us back to New York."

"I don't know who was supposed to cover third there....he's faster than I am....heads-up player...."

In a game of seemingly infinite mound conferences, it seems odd that this truly useful subject never came up for discussion.

by **CalvinBall** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:37:45

i agree bucky. ricky bo is pissed about it. i am starting not to like him, he needs to give these guys some credit. it is such a weird once in every 2,500 games circumstance that i just dont know.

i am willing to bet if this happened to ricky bo damon would have somehow scored. shut up dude.

by **Mountainphan** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 01:39:11

The issue isn't about using Lidge in the 9th or Lidge/Ruiz not covering third. It's all about pitch selection and field positioning (in the 9th and other innings) that made no sense. The good news, fwiw, is since the playoffs started, Lidge continues to look like 2008 Lidge when he is mixing his pitches. I'm still confident in Lidge provided he and Ruiz learn something from tonight.

Whatever - it all adds up to one big gut punch that the Phils need to get over ASAP.

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World Series 2009 Game 4 Thread: TONIGHT IS OUR NIGHT