I think it may partially be a function of how hard it is to bang in the post. Embiid is the only player in the league capable of doing it efficiently and it may be asking too much to expect him to do it for 48 minutes.
At the same time, we’re not going anywhere if we can’t give the ball to Jo in the last four minutes of the game without him just praying for a whistle.
I don’t know if he needs better conditioning, we need an offense that isn’t going to tire him out in a half, or some combination of the two. But whatever the fix is, we need it bad.
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Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Gimpy » Wed Sep 02, 2020 17:39:58
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by mtcal » Wed Sep 02, 2020 17:41:09
i still feel like jo shouldn't be the guy inbounding the ball after every bucket to have to run down the court to catch up with everyone already down there most of the game.
Not everything I think is something I should say.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Napalm » Wed Sep 02, 2020 17:46:18
mtcal wrote:i still feel like jo shouldn't be the guy inbounding the ball after every bucket to have to run down the court to catch up with everyone already down there most of the game.
Catch up? No need to when you can build an offense around him trailing the 3 ball at the top of the key. 26 feet saved. Bank that in the conditioning log book
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by joe table » Wed Sep 02, 2020 17:55:00
We certainly need better options around him who can take the offensive load off of him - no disagreements there. It’s a separate issue from his conditioning though
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by ek20 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 17:55:02
Looks like some smoke on Ty Lue
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Grotewold » Wed Sep 02, 2020 17:58:00
ek20 wrote:Looks like some smoke on Ty Lue
I'm not gonna hold that against him
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by joe table » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:00:40
In terms of other star bigs - jokic also not in good enough shape and you see that with lazy fouls on defense (was super fortunate not to foul out last night - horrible 4th fool on a lazy reach and got 5th foul at 8 min mark in 4th). Gobert though was playing his best in 4th quarter in game seven and beasting in both ends - blocking jokic shots in post ups, contesting everything at the rim, finishing through contact. He’s way better conditioned than jo and nowhere near as talented on offense
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by MoBettle » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:01:00
He's tiring in the second half because he's trying to carry a bunch of scrubs all game and it's hard to do for 48 minutes.
Zone makes big man offense and defense completely different. There's a reason why there are no recent comps. On offense teams can soft double him whenever he gets the ball in the post and then on defense he's expected to play free safety at the rim while people get on his ass for not covering shooters 30 feet out. I don't think Wilt was doing a lot of the latter during his 46 minutes a game.
Fwiw Jokic who is going to get 1st team all NBA for the 2nd year in a row played 36 minutes last night in a close game 7, had Murray creating a bunch of offense, and was having Plumlee getting cycled in for him on defense down the stretch.
Zone makes big man offense and defense completely different. There's a reason why there are no recent comps. On offense teams can soft double him whenever he gets the ball in the post and then on defense he's expected to play free safety at the rim while people get on his ass for not covering shooters 30 feet out. I don't think Wilt was doing a lot of the latter during his 46 minutes a game.
Fwiw Jokic who is going to get 1st team all NBA for the 2nd year in a row played 36 minutes last night in a close game 7, had Murray creating a bunch of offense, and was having Plumlee getting cycled in for him on defense down the stretch.
Two days later I get a text back that says I'm a basketball player and a businessman, not a Thundercat.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by joe table » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:04:52
I said jokic needs to improve his conditioning too there (and I think few would disagree with that either) but when’s the last time jo had a huge 4th quarter performance in a playoff win. It’s an issue that he wears down even if he doesn’t have enough help
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by MoBettle » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:10:03
Well he certainly had conditioning issues the two playoff runs prior because he was directly coming off an injury. Like he was basically on a minute restriction in the Nets series last year because he played in like 7 games post ASB. That said he was playing a huge amount of minutes towards the end of that raptor series.
Last edited by MoBettle on Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:10:55, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Napalm » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:10:22
joe table wrote:We certainly need better options around him who can take the offensive load off of him - no disagreements there. It’s a separate issue from his conditioning though
Early on in his career, he couldn't be bothered to awake unless there was a pseudo mind game at stake vs another center. Then, he needed to be the peoples champ. The troll was strong. I feel like him taming it down and finding maturity is its own battle. He grew up so wildly different from us, that fame and fortune aren't the goals he strives for. Sure he wants to win and be the greatest, but at what joyless cost? I think now that the funny has died down and the process nickname has been sacked, there exists an expectation he carrys for those around him. His disappointment and eventual withdrawal is evident, and imo, he still battles it out harder than the rest amidst that. These are the lost timelines of his life. Potential being squandered, whether by his own doing or those around him, but because the relationship is symbiotic, it's probably both.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by JFLNYC » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:12:54
MoBettle wrote:He's tiring in the second half because he's trying to carry a bunch of scrubs all game and it's hard to do for 48 minutes.
Zone makes big man offense and defense completely different. There's a reason why there are no recent comps. On offense teams can soft double him whenever he gets the ball in the post and then on defense he's expected to play free safety at the rim while people get on his ass for not covering shooters 30 feet out. I don't think Wilt was doing a lot of the latter during his 46 minutes a game.
Fwiw Jokic who is going to get 1st team all NBA for the 2nd year in a row played 36 minutes last night in a close game 7, had Murray creating a bunch of offense, and was having Plumlee getting cycled in for him on defense down the stretch.
Fair points. Today’s game is more demanding of big man. As I said before, though, if Jo has only a set number of effective minutes in a game, we better save several of them for end of game because we won’t win the big games consistently without an effective EOG Jo.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by joe table » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:13:19
With the short offseason I do hope we try to manage his mins early in reg season like Bucks were able to do with Giannis is regular season (and then get him ramped up more down the stretch). And assuming we can’t unload Horford he should help with that. We’ll see though
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by JFLNYC » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:15:08
I think Brett did a crap job on minutes with both Jo and Al during the regular season. He needed to give KOQ or Pelle regular minutes to get both Jo and Al the rest they needed.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Napalm » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:18:58
joe table wrote:With the short offseason I do hope we try to manage his mins early in reg season like Bucks were able to do with Giannis is regular season (and then get him ramped up more down the stretch). And assuming we can’t unload Horford he should help with that. We’ll see though
This gives me flashbacks to the ghost of Brett and we are still in the 'too soon' phase.
I think all of our perspectives have merit, and they fall under a unified umbrella theory involving the esoteric, the logician, and the statistician. These are still the shades of Brett, and I hope we can shed them and get down to real business.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by jamiethekiller » Wed Sep 02, 2020 18:55:55
Think I've said several times this year that embiid just physiologically isn't able to be 36m a night shape. No matter how hard he works, his body is never going to let him have stamina. It's why I think the horford deal is still a good deal and Brett blew it.
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Squire » Wed Sep 02, 2020 19:27:05
Embiid tweeting that he is still really unhappy
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by SixerLed3 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 19:27:54
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by Squire » Wed Sep 02, 2020 19:29:40
Apparently it's about a Mointain Dew commercial
My bad
My bad
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Re: Sixers 2020 Offseason Thread 1.0
by ek20 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 19:29:49
Pretty sure thats from the mountain dew commercial lol
Last edited by ek20 on Wed Sep 02, 2020 19:33:30, edited 1 time in total.
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