The B1G Piece wrote:This team is terrible.

This is an over-reaction to the start of a season, but that's what we fans do.

Unfortunately, this year is one where we need to get out of the gate at least around .500, and it's going to be tough to right the ship versus the 10-1 Yankees.

phillychuck wrote:

The B1G Piece wrote:This team is terrible.

This is an over-reaction to the start of a season, but that's what we fans do.

Unfortunately, this year is one where we need to get out of the gate at least around .500, and it's going to be tough to right the ship versus the 10-1 Yankees.

They should have the starting pitching advantage in both games today and there should be limited middle relief nonsense. Who knows what you're getting from Eflin tomorrow but there's no reason they can't win 2 out of 3 in their home ballpark.

And really as you said the season might sort of depend on it. They have 4 against the Braves next who are playing great despite a bunch of nonsense themselves and who knows how much of the season they're actually going to get in. If they come out of these next 7 games at like 3-8 and they only play 50 games or so (which seems pretty optimistic) you're talking about playing like .600 baseball to have the winning % you're probably going to need to qualify for the playoffs.

ek20 wrote:Any bullpen guys in there lol

Any downside to using Howard in the pen right now?

SCPhillyPhan wrote:

WhiteyFan wrote:
Moving forward, all available funds need to be spent on pitching, definitely not on old catchers.

Well, this argument helps me rationalize not signing JT. My logic says it's too much money. My emotions say he's the best catcher in baseball, so we need to sign him. Plus we gave up a pretty good P prospect. But, yeah, all assets need to go to pitching at this point in time.

This is basically the Tobias Harris situation but with a (much?) better player.

MoBettle wrote:

phillychuck wrote:

The B1G Piece wrote:This team is terrible.

This is an over-reaction to the start of a season, but that's what we fans do.

Unfortunately, this year is one where we need to get out of the gate at least around .500, and it's going to be tough to right the ship versus the 10-1 Yankees.

They should have the starting pitching advantage in both games today and there should be limited middle relief nonsense. Who knows what you're getting from Eflin tomorrow but there's no reason they can't win 2 out of 3 in their home ballpark.

And really as you said the season might sort of depend on it. They have 4 against the Braves next who are playing great despite a bunch of nonsense themselves and who knows how much of the season they're actually going to get in. If they come out of these next 7 games at like 3-8 and they only play 50 games or so (which seems pretty optimistic) you're talking about playing like .600 baseball to have the winning % you're probably going to need to qualify for the playoffs.

I have no faith the phillies will win any game where they have to use their bullpen

PSUsarge wrote:

SCPhillyPhan wrote:

WhiteyFan wrote:
Moving forward, all available funds need to be spent on pitching, definitely not on old catchers.

Well, this argument helps me rationalize not signing JT. My logic says it's too much money. My emotions say he's the best catcher in baseball, so we need to sign him. Plus we gave up a pretty good P prospect. But, yeah, all assets need to go to pitching at this point in time.

This is basically the Tobias Harris situation but with a (much?) better player.

Well Tobias is 27 and barring injury is going to be in his prime (as underwhelming as you may find it) throughout the deal whereas there’s a real risk JT completely falls off and you have another Ryan Howard fiasco.

Also Sixto has like actual ace upside as opposed to giving up a rotation guard and two late firsts.

Plus the Sixers actually thought they had a chance to win a title at the time whereas the Phillies are still pretty far away.

Speaking of Jean, his contract is part of the reason they felt they had to wait on signing JT so they couldn’t drag the AAV of his deal down long term by including this year‘s salary.

Sixers were also limited to the moves they could make if they didn't Sign Harris, right? Phillies can make plenty of moves if they don't sign JT. Big differences in MLB salary cap and NBA.

I think Alex Carr has Logan O'Hoppe pegged as the next Pudge Rodriguez + Carlton Fisk + Johnny Bench, so we should be good.

SCPhillyPhan wrote:

ek20 wrote:Any bullpen guys in there lol

Any downside to using Howard in the pen right now?

yeah, him not being in the rotation.

MoBettle wrote:
Also Sixto has like actual ace upside as opposed to giving up a rotation guard and two late firsts.

When the deal for JT went down, IMO, Sixto was the toughest piece to give away. Now he seems to have faded. Reports are that he has put on weight; not been able to improve his pitch repertoire or increase his stamina. May end being a RP in the end. Despite all of the Marlins roster issues, they have not brought him up.

rolex wrote:

MoBettle wrote:
Also Sixto has like actual ace upside as opposed to giving up a rotation guard and two late firsts.

When the deal for JT went down, IMO, Sixto was the toughest piece to give away. Now he seems to have faded. Reports are that he has put on weight; not been able to improve his pitch repertoire or increase his stamina. May end being a RP in the end. Despite all of the Marlins roster issues, they have not brought him up.

Fair I haven’t been keeping track lately. May be analogous to the Miami pick ultimately.

ReadingPhilly wrote:

SCPhillyPhan wrote:

ek20 wrote:Any bullpen guys in there lol

Any downside to using Howard in the pen right now?

yeah, him not being in the rotation.

He has to be. Too many games to pack in there

There's still a lot of season left and it's a bit of a crapshoot statistically speaking with only 60 games, but I'm thinking there's going to be a pretty strong argument that Ed Wade did better in his first five seasons (as GM) than Klentak.

If they win tomorrow, they'll be 3-4 and right in this thing. If they lose, the season is over. It's that simple.

So it's all on Zach Eflin

Well ain't that reassuring

I have faith in The Elfin One

sent garlick and de los santos, who i had no idea was even up, down to get the roster to 28.

I get that Klentak hasn't fixed the bullpen. However, it just seems like every strategy that he has employed has failed miserably.

1. Signing a couple of mid-tier guys (Neshek, Hunter)
2. Signing a top tier guy (Robertson)
3. Hoping all the guys on your team bounceback from bad years last year

I don't know what the answer is but it pretty clear that Klentak doesn't either.

Also, I know its only been a week but I am really starting to wonder whether Rhys Hoskins is a part of this franchise's future.

Squire wrote:I get that Klentak hasn't fixed the bullpen. However, it just seems like every strategy that he has employed has failed miserably.

1. Signing a couple of mid-tier guys (Neshek, Hunter)
2. Signing a top tier guy (Robertson)
3. Hoping all the guys on your team bounceback from bad years last year

I don't know what the answer is but it pretty clear that Klentak doesn't either.

Also, I know its only been a week but I am really starting to wonder whether Rhys Hoskins is a part of this franchise's future.

Agree on Klentak's bullpen moves. None of the different approaches yielded results. Of course I think you can say that about nearly all his moves.

Unless things turn around I think it's best to shop quite a few players including Rhys.