Super Fun Time Politics Thread in Which We Discuss Stuff

by **joe table** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 13:59:49

jerseyhoya wrote:Hopefully the 2-3 dozen members who #$!&@ their party and their speaker over feel good about how they stood on principle as they pay more in taxes.

This is what pissed me off about the whole thing, interesting to see it annoyed (at least one) conservative as well

by **jerseyhoya** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 14:18:39

joe table wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:Hopefully the 2-3 dozen members who #$!&@ their party and their speaker over feel good about how they stood on principle as they pay more in taxes.

This is what pissed me off about the whole thing, interesting to see it annoyed (at least one) conservative as well

80-90% of the caucus was ready to pass the bill, but he lost more votes than he could afford. Inside the Meltdown - an awful lot of anger at those rebelling.

by **td11** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 15:07:56

i dunno, sounds like boehner might've had more than 10-20% defecting

Another senior member told me that Boehner was always going to struggle with the whip count since most House conservatives have little interest in seeing the speaker strike any kind of deal.

by **jerseyhoya** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 15:24:37

He could afford to lose 24, and it seemed like the number was into the 30s or maybe 40s. Publicly declared no votes were in the mid 20s. 10-20% of the caucus.

Once it became clear that it wouldn't pass, if he brought it to the floor it would have gotten practically no votes, but that's a different story.

by **pacino** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 15:48:02

25 of the ayes won't be in Congress by January, while 19 of 22 of the nays will be.

by **TenuredVulture** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 17:51:21

jerseyhoya wrote:
No matter what happens 16+ Republicans aren't voting for Nancy Pelosi for Speaker.

No. But it's possible that the Republican caucus won't come to an agreement about who they want as speaker. In essence, then you've got three parties, and the Democrats have a plurality. I really don't know the nuts and bolts of procedure--can a bunch of people just leave their caucus and set up their own party? Can people be expelled from a caucus? That is, can the Republican Caucus kick out say 10 of the most rabid teapartiers (to encourage the others)? Can the house function without a speaker? The rules on all this aren't really clear. There's a potential for a huge mess here.

By the way, since I am country first, I really don't see this as a good thing. I really think the system requires two responsible parties to function properly.

by **pacino** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 18:42:30

obama basically 'let's solve this shit, it ain't that tough you morons'.

his both sides meme gets old, though. both sides aren't the reason for this.

he name-dropped gun safety

by **allentown** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 20:17:20

The Republican hypocrisy on the fiscal stiff is just staggering. Their major complaint is that Obama hasn't approved enough cuts in Medicare and Social Security over the next decade. This after this year's Republican House budget, their presidential candidate and their vice-presidential candidate promised zero reductions in these programs over the next decade and in fact attacked Obama for his Medicare spending cuts. How quickly we forget the 'read my lips' equivalent of 'no changes in Medicare or Social Security for anyone now under 55'. In other words, we want to make changes starting 10 years from now. Granted, the changes they seek are radical, but still no savings and no reduction in entitlement spending for a decade, other than perhaps Medicaid, but the majority of that goes to senior's nursing homes and it was intimated that this also wouldn't be cut for anyone now under 55. Romney also promised to substantially increase defense spending. The mathematical unsoundness of the Ryan budget and the Romney plan are coming home to roost. The Republicans simply don't have a plan. It's a lot of blather, blather, don't raise taxes, blather, blater, let's cut the nebulous waste and fraud. In this whole process, apart from NPR,PBS, family planning, and foreign aid to states not named Israel, the Republicans haven't proposed a single spending cut or loophole to be closed, all the while complaining that President Obama hasn't given them enough specific savings. This approach didn't fly in the election and it won't fly today.

by **JFLNYC** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 20:59:33

allentown wrote:In other words, we want to make changes starting 10 years from now.

This thing about enacting legislation which doesn't go into effect for years, so it's somebody else's problem, is disgusting on both sides of the aisle.

by **TenuredVulture** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 21:11:46

Republicans offer a plan that benefits the +55 group, leaving everyone else holding the bag, and then wonder why Obama and the Dems are "hip".

by **CalvinBall** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 02:47:03

jerseyhoya wrote:He could afford to lose 24, and it seemed like the number was into the 30s or maybe 40s. Publicly declared no votes were in the mid 20s. 10-20% of the caucus.

Once it became clear that it wouldn't pass, if he brought it to the floor it would have gotten practically no votes, but that's a different story.

A congressman from Ohio was on NPR. He said that there are about 45 to 48 that are pretty openly against making a deal. Can't be sure of the exaxt count. It is something the leaders will take to their grave. Anyways, he calls these extreme right representatives chuckleheads. They just want to be obstructionists. They are blown away when Boehner has to talk to the Dems to get votes and get pissed when a bill becomes more democratic.

He said he wasn't very optimistic that something will get done.

by **Phan In Phlorida** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 04:40:35

A group of baboons is called a congress.

Same for buffoons.

by **pacino** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 09:22:55

chuck hagel's a dick

by **thephan** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:09:18

pacino wrote:they'd probably be more thankful for the job they'd have instead of the current home basement apartment and 20hr/wk at Walmart.

Cliff diving layoffs went down in time for the holidays. Ho Ho Ho.

by **pacino** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:18:05

North Korea has detained an American citizen for crimes he supposedly stated he committed. Obvious bullshit, and just a way to negotiate some money from the US or whatever

by **pacino** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:19:49

Q3 growth has been revised up to 3.1%

by **pacino** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 16:43:06

oh my, apparently the prez is stronger than appears:

Mr. Obama repeatedly lost patience with the speaker as negotiations faltered. In an Oval Office meeting last week, he told Mr. Boehner that if the sides didn't reach agreement, he would use his inaugural address and his State of the Union speech to tell the country the Republicans were at fault.

At one point, according to notes taken by a participant, Mr. Boehner told the president, "I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?"

"You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

by **Doll Is Mine** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 16:49:09

Andrew Sullivan ‏@sullydish
This party is threat to democratic discourse and fiscal sanity. Their ideological mania knows no restraint at all

by **jerseyhoya** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 16:52:00

If anyone knows about threats to sanity, it's Andrew Sullivan

by **Doll Is Mine** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 17:05:14

jerseyhoya wrote:If anyone knows about threats to sanity, it's Andrew Sullivan

I'm surprised to hear you say that because Sullivan could very well be the gay version of, well, you.

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