We need somehow to get to a place where we think about taxes not as inherently evil (the way, say, Jim DeMint and Grover Norquist do) or good (the way I'm told some extremists on the left do), but as a means to an end with positive and negative consequences.

What has me going today is the rationale that extending the tax cuts is a form of stimulus.

it's got me stimulatin' that's for sure

dajafi wrote:We need somehow to get to a place where we think about taxes not as inherently evil (the way, say, Jim DeMint and Grover Norquist do) or good (the way I'm told some extremists on the left do), but as a means to an end with positive and negative consequences.

You might have to start by changing government from something that is inherently evil to a means to an end with positive and negative consequences.

kruker wrote:Olbermann and Maddow both had tremendous commentaries on the President's presser today. Both saying that he was easily irritated and testy, especially at his liberal critics.

What's another word for easily irritated and testy? Petulant? Maybe smooth should write to Keith and Rachel about their improper characterization. Perhaps insinuate that they're both racists.

I don't get the "easily" part

It's an affront to the scores of congresspersons whose many, many long hours of determined jackassery produced Barry's irritation

I dont think im evil.

Obama is getting dangerously close to losing my vote. Three of his biggest campaign points were closing of guantanamo, end of don't ask don't tell, and expiration of Bush tax cuts.

All he had to do to keep his promise on #2 was literally do nothing, but he couldn't even do that. It doesn't matter how much your views align with a politician's if they are a giant vag who doesn't stand up for anything they supposively believe in.

Bring on Romney. I really don't care anymore.

Bucky wrote:it's got me stimulatin' that's for sure

It makes people happy, but it doesn't encourage them to spend more than what they are now. Saying that they can spend more than what they would be able to had the cuts expired is completely different than implementing a stimulus. We need to increase demand from current levels, not from that of a hypothetical future.

That makes sense...

drsmooth wrote:

kruker wrote:Olbermann and Maddow both had tremendous commentaries on the President's presser today. Both saying that he was easily irritated and testy, especially at his liberal critics.

What's another word for easily irritated and testy? Petulant? Maybe smooth should write to Keith and Rachel about their improper characterization. Perhaps insinuate that they're both racists.

I don't get the "easily" part

It's an affront to the scores of congresspersons whose many, many long hours of determined jackassery produced Barry's irritation

I'll give you that.

I promise to spend my tax cut on domestic beer.

TenuredVulture wrote:I promise to spend my tax cut on domestic beer.

I know you're joking, but the argument is driving me insane. How many people were setting aside money or reducing their spending because of the tax cuts potentially expiring? For those that did, and I really can't fathom any significant segment of the population having done this, then there would be a stimulative effect. Otherwise, people are spending what they already have at their current expenditure levels.

Can the Republicans drop the deficit charade now?

phdave wrote:

dajafi wrote:We need somehow to get to a place where we think about taxes not as inherently evil (the way, say, Jim DeMint and Grover Norquist do) or good (the way I'm told some extremists on the left do), but as a means to an end with positive and negative consequences.

You might have to start by changing government from something that is inherently evil to a means to an end with positive and negative consequences.

Yeah, good point.

The Nightman Cometh wrote:Obama is getting dangerously close to losing my vote. Three of his biggest campaign points were closing of guantanamo, end of don't ask don't tell, and expiration of Bush tax cuts.

I don't recall this.

jerseyhoya wrote: There really only appear to be two options here, either the deal Obama and the GOP worked out passes or the tax cuts expire. Republicans have absolutely no incentive to give anything more than they did to get Obama on board.

What

VoxOrion wrote:

The Nightman Cometh wrote:Obama is getting dangerously close to losing my vote. Three of his biggest campaign points were closing of guantanamo, end of don't ask don't tell, and expiration of Bush tax cuts.

I don't recall this.

For those over 250k. My bad.

jerseyhoya wrote:What

Your own wingnut faction is squirming:

DeMinted response to the tax deal hubbub

McConnell's a bootlicking toad, but like a good used-car salesman he knows enough to shut up when the deal he wanted - preserve plutocrax cuts - got done.

The lunatic DeMint is prepared to insist Captain Slackpants and company protract the discussion with some sort of assertion that it's not enough to bathe the genitals of our economic superiors with our saliva - we must simultaneously analrape the unfortunate sans lube.

Also, Harry Reid is trying to insert language in the tax bill that would legalize on-line gambling in such a way that it would benefit Vegas Casinos and even though they gave a few hundred thou to his campaign, it's not payback.