Blumenthal, Paul and other idiots...POLITICS Thread

Postby allentown » Fri Jul 02, 2010 09:55:33

drsmooth wrote:David Brooks with a get-well card to (or pre-eulogy for) Christopher Hitchins, which semi-self-consciously makes a case for David Brooks as the bizarro Hitchins

I think you've got it pegged correctly. This is Brooks trying to remind us what an erudite intellectual he is, with vast literary underpinnings to his political analysis. Hitchins and Brooks both push for a moral, values-based foreign policy, which ignores our inability to impose our ethics and moral view on other peoples at gunpoint. This seems to be a combination of the 'white man's burden' spreading of Christianity and culture as an excuse for rapacious colonial imperialism that got the support of the church ladies for these evil European policies and the sense that if foreign policy had been more moral over the years, Hitler would have been prevented from murdering so many Jews and others during WWII and its runup. In reality, this 'moral' policy that Brooks, Bush, and the neocons espoused, ignored instances of genocide in the Sudan, Congo, etc. and used morality as an excuse to wage the Iraq war of choice that they so badly wanted to wage. This gives us our own sops to those in search of a moral foreign policy to get their acquiescence to our current wars: we educate Afghani girls, we impose government requirements in Iraq and Afghanistan for more female legislators than we have ever had in this country. Never mind that these attempts to change tribal or national cultures will be swept away as soon as we leave and that none of these women legislators has any real power. We chose Karzai, we've tolerated a rigged election, but we can say we are supporting democracy. To their credit, the American people won't tolerate a war for base causes. To our discredit, we are easily conned with these flimsy moral appeals. The only recent 'moral' war was Bill Clinton's intervention in Yugoslavia to stop the genocide and that was universally panned by the Republican crowd. Afghanistan was a search and destroy mission against the 9/11 terrorist sponsors and Iraq was a war of choice for reasons that are still not understood.
We now know that Amaro really is running the Phillies. He and Monty seem to have ignored the committee.
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Postby pacino » Fri Jul 02, 2010 18:51:51

is glenn beck really holding a rally at the same place on the same day as Martin Luther King Jr's most famous speech? Pathetic. I'm stunned.

who was it that said that al franken was a joke? i disagree I had to watch this twice to understand it, but it appears that franken pretty rightly discusses how Marshall wasn't some crazy activist judge.
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Postby cshort » Sat Jul 03, 2010 09:01:28

pacino wrote:is glenn beck really holding a rally at the same place on the same day as Martin Luther King Jr's most famous speech? Pathetic. I'm stunned.

who was it that said that al franken was a joke? i disagree I had to watch this twice to understand it, but it appears that franken pretty rightly discusses how Marshall wasn't some crazy activist judge.


I don't think people ever thought he was dumb, just that he was a douche
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Postby drsmooth » Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:14:04

cshort wrote:
I don't think people ever thought he was dumb, just that he was a douche


you're right, it's abundantly clear to any sentient being that Beck is as dumb as a box of rocks.

plenty douchey too.

oh, you meant franken
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Postby Rococo4 » Mon Jul 05, 2010 00:53:18

cshort wrote:
pacino wrote:is glenn beck really holding a rally at the same place on the same day as Martin Luther King Jr's most famous speech? Pathetic. I'm stunned.

who was it that said that al franken was a joke? i disagree I had to watch this twice to understand it, but it appears that franken pretty rightly discusses how Marshall wasn't some crazy activist judge.


I don't think people ever thought he was dumb, just that he was a douche


it was me and I think he is both

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Postby drsmooth » Mon Jul 05, 2010 10:42:47

Ross Douchehat takes a good post-7/4 op-ed theme and bungs it up:

The Pessimism Bubble

Go back and read Jimmy Carter’s famous “malaise speech,” which liberals have lately been rehabilitating. With its warnings about retrenchment, rationing and a permanent energy crisis, it feels like a contemporary document. But it isn’t, and Carter’s prophecies were wrong: the grimmest speech any modern president has given was delivered just a few years before America kicked off a long era of impressive economic growth.


In one paragraph, RD welds any misgivings about the virtues of "economic growth" - the definition for which term he's apparently happy to take, unchallenged, from his financial betters - to the reactionaries' favorite wimpy whipping boy, Jimmy Carter.

"Don't have faith in 'economic growth'? You probably DO have faith in that wussy peanut farmer, nyuk nyuk".

Two problems with that "impressive economic growth", Ross: 1) the evidence that it made much impression on the economic status of most people in the US is troublingly ambiguous; and 2) it's much easier to find credible evidence that much of that "growth" took the form of cooked books.

Others elsewhere have pointed out that the speech got a positive reception; that it was Carter's actions in its wake (turning out his Cabinet whoelsale) that caused him problems.

There's some good, non-"grim" stuff in that much-maligned speech:

We know the strength of America. We are strong. We can regain our unity. We can regain our confidence. We are the heirs of generations who survived threats much more powerful and awesome than those that challenge us now. Our fathers and mothers were strong men and women who shaped a new society during the Great Depression, who fought world wars, and who carved out a new charter of peace for the world.

We ourselves are the same Americans who just ten years ago put a man on the Moon. We are the generation that dedicated our society to the pursuit of human rights and equality. And we are the generation that will win the war on the energy problem and in that process rebuild the unity and confidence of America.

We are at a turning point in our history. There are two paths to choose. One is a path I've warned about tonight, the path that leads to fragmentation and self-interest. Down that road lies a mistaken idea of freedom, the right to grasp for ourselves some advantage over others. That path would be one of constant conflict between narrow interests ending in chaos and immobility. It is a certain route to failure.

All the traditions of our past, all the lessons of our heritage, all the promises of our future point to another path, the path of common purpose and the restoration of American values. That path leads to true freedom for our nation and ourselves.


Please, if your feeling is that "constant conflict between narrow interests" is not a looming obstacle to enduring social wellbeing, explain yourself. Explain why over-layering yet another tissue of fictive "impressive economic growth", since "growth" allows us all to forget our fundamental challenges in a wallow of high-calorie, low-nutrition consumerist satiety, is a superior strategy.

Because Ross doesn't do it for you.
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Postby dajafi » Mon Jul 05, 2010 11:22:32

Of all the ways that Douthat has been brutally disappointing since joining the Times op-ed roster (and here we should pause to note that he's still immeasurably better than Bill Kristol, the Baghdad Bob of contemporary pseudo-conservatism), the worst is that he seems to have lost all capacity to understand, or at least to articulate, that his metrics for socioeconomic success aren't the same as everybody else's. This is only a bummer because the Douthat of a few years ago, the "Party of Sam's Club" Douthat, really did seem to understand that in a democratic republic, unless things are getting better at the median, it's very difficult to make a convincing case that they're really getting better at all.

Meanwhile, here's the biggest misfire of Carter's speech:

We can regain our unity.


I'm starting to think that the most significant point of division--and this also gets to whether, style points and pop culture preferences aside, Al Franken is a great public servant (warning: link not for the easily offended) or an utter tool--is whether the greatest threat to Americans' prosperity and quality of life comes from government or industry. See this:

The liberal constitutional vision in the years before World War II was an inseparable part of the liberal ideal of the right relationship between the government and business, especially the financial markets. Liberals argued that the capitalist system could not survive its internal or external threats unless it was tempered and constrained by government regulation. The point of that regulation was not to subvert the market but to save it. One job of the Constitution, on this view, was to allow the government to protect its citizens and itself from the market’s tendency to dominate everything that came into its path. F. D. R.’s supporters did not see the court as the primary government institution for regulating the market, but they did say that the court must implement the regulatory objectives chosen by the president, Congress and the administrative agencies. In contrast, constitutional conservatives at the time argued that the job of the court was to act as a check on government in its efforts to regulate the markets — to protect private property against its erosion and to preserve capitalism against the threat of socialism.

The fundamental difference, then, between constitutional liberals and constitutional conservatives was on the question of whom they feared most. Liberals feared that, unregulated, business and markets might destroy both themselves and republican government. Conservatives shared the liberals’ fear about the fate of republican government, worrying that, unfettered, regulation might destroy private property, the market and capitalism itself. Both sides contended that the Constitution ought to be interpreted in the light of their substantive views about the dangers to a system of democratic capitalism that both sides equally embraced.

Today, we are moving toward a contemporary version of this debate between liberals and conservatives about what we need to fear most — an overreaching state or unconstrained market forces. The positions in this debate today are not identical to what they were three-quarters of a century ago, but there are important similarities. Progressives today view regulation as the necessary response to the market failures that led to the present economic crisis. Many conservatives fear that taking regulation too far will cripple the possibilities of economic recovery and long-term growth. These differences are not only shaping the leading political debates of our day, but framed in terms of constitutional rights like free speech and due process, will also determine the outcomes of important constitutional challenges to legislative and regulatory reforms. And progressive constitutional thought, in its current form, may not always be adequate to produce the desired progressive outcomes.


To me, this isn't much of a question: the government is by, for and of the people, who can change its composition or emphasis pretty much at will after a short lag. The corporation is by, for and of only those with a fiduciary stake in it, with its only constraints being those imposed by market competition, and those constraints only having any meaning if the market "works" properly... which itself is the role of government. But then, I'm a liberal; of course I think this way.

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Postby Bakestar » Mon Jul 05, 2010 19:43:30

Waiting with baited breath for Matt Drudge to snarkily post a "global warming" article in light of the current heatwave, like he does during blizzards...
Foreskin stupid

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Postby VoxOrion » Tue Jul 06, 2010 06:53:50

He's been posting weather/heat stuff all week. He's like, obsessed with any kind of weather.
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Postby TenuredVulture » Tue Jul 06, 2010 12:27:05

Be Bold!

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Postby pacino » Tue Jul 06, 2010 20:25:08

thephan wrote:pacino's posting is one of the more important things revealed in weeks.

Calvinball wrote:Pacino was right.

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Postby z ipper » Tue Jul 06, 2010 20:46:17

that bitch tells it like it is. me and my friends started this collapse in '89 by giving away outrageous amounts of kool-aid at well below cost.

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Postby azrider » Tue Jul 06, 2010 22:54:15

z ipper wrote:that bitch tells it like it is. me and my friends started this collapse in '89 by giving away outrageous amounts of kool-aid at well below cost.


obviously this had to have been in a red state. there is no way this s%*t would have gone down and someone would not have lost a knee or two trying to undercut the union.

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Postby jerseyhoya » Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:23:04

Momentum is building for there to be a special election for Byrd's seat in November. Manchin would probably run, and would be a heavy favorite to start off. Much respect for him looking into pushing for the early special election even when he could appoint a crony to hold down the fort for two years.

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Postby traderdave » Wed Jul 07, 2010 17:47:10



Well you kinda have to admire her "out-of-the-box" thinking on this one. She is still an idiot but at least she is going for it. So, did everyone enjoy Rush's racist rant yesterday?

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Postby kimbatiste » Thu Jul 08, 2010 19:29:13

http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaki ... res_3.html

District of Massachusetts holds DOMA unconstitutional. I'm not that surprised at the ruling but shocked at the Judge (Tauro) who did.

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Postby TenuredVulture » Fri Jul 09, 2010 00:47:59

Image

Rachel Maddow.
Be Bold!

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Postby jerseyhoya » Fri Jul 09, 2010 00:49:04

Not drop dead gorgeous, but more attractive than you would imagine

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Postby pacino » Fri Jul 09, 2010 18:06:01

thephan wrote:pacino's posting is one of the more important things revealed in weeks.

Calvinball wrote:Pacino was right.

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Postby drsmooth » Mon Jul 12, 2010 11:46:05

For any of you who stubbornly continue to imagine that politics & economics do & should delineate distinct fields of human endeavor, I give you this atrociously-titled regional news story to chew on:

Mass. Cities, Towns Want More Health Care Control

Of course MA cities & towns want no such thing as "more health care control" - what they want is a chance to manage their budgets, and an ok to disregard existing contracts and make unilateral decisions about the terms of those contracts to do so.

if I'm a disinterested (non-public employee) resident of those places, I say sure thing - but while you're at it amend our local charters to enable quick & easy recall of the mayor, any alderman, and anyone else in authority, just to keep things in balance.

Basically, there's a clamor to re-set the operating terms of "the market" in those jurisdictions. Who knew that those terms weren't as fixed as the law of gravity?
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