The Dude wrote:Climategategate

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... e-sceptics

He cannot be a serious grown up person.

What would you expect? He's a politician who has advanced to a position of leadership in a dysfunctional party in an increasingly dysfunctional country. His grip on reality is likely to be tenuous at best.

“The Obama Administration continues to defy the will of the American people who strongly supported the bipartisan decision of Congress in 2008 to lift the moratorium on offshore drilling not just off the East Coast and in the Gulf of Mexico, but off the Pacific Coast and Alaskan shores as well. Opening up areas off the Virginia coast to offshore production is a positive step, but keeping the Pacific Coast and Alaska, as well as the most promising resources off the Gulf of Mexico, under lock and key makes no sense at a time when gasoline prices are rising and Americans are asking ‘Where are the jobs?’

“It’s long past time for this Administration to stop delaying American energy production off all our shores and start listening to the American people who want an “all of the above” strategy to produce more American energy and create more jobs. Republicans are listening to the American people and have proposed a better solution – the American Energy Act – which will lower gas prices, increase American energy production, promote new clean and renewable sources of energy, and encourage greater efficiency and conservation.”

The full bit Boehner's statement that talks about the drilling decision

Yeah he sure is a crazy person. Out of touch with reality. Commends the step as a good, but insufficient one. Says the GOP bill that goes further as being more in step with public opinion.

What a child!

pacino wrote:Sounds like a reasonable approach, though I disagree wtih doing it.

I'm with you, pacino, especially when you hear news reports on supposedly pro-Democrat MSNBC about how when all is said and done tapping 100% of the available oil reserves in the areas opened will yield no more than eight years worth of consumption. I don't know whether that is true or not but it does make you wonder a bit about the efficiency of this approach as opposed to focusing on clean energy. Sadly, I think Obama may just be trying to "buy" GOP support on things he really wants to get done.

... and Americans are asking ‘Where are the jobs?

I could be WAYYYYY off base here but wouldn't this new policy create jobs?

Its funny because drilling off our shore isn't going to do much in the way of job creation or gas prices. The lack of critical thinking displayed on this issue is mind boggling.

jerseyhoya wrote:

“The Obama Administration continues to defy the will of the American people who strongly supported the bipartisan decision of Congress in 2008 to lift the moratorium on offshore drilling not just off the East Coast and in the Gulf of Mexico, but off the Pacific Coast and Alaskan shores as well. Opening up areas off the Virginia coast to offshore production is a positive step, but keeping the Pacific Coast and Alaska, as well as the most promising resources off the Gulf of Mexico, under lock and key makes no sense at a time when gasoline prices are rising and Americans are asking ‘Where are the jobs?’

“It’s long past time for this Administration to stop delaying American energy production off all our shores and start listening to the American people who want an “all of the above” strategy to produce more American energy and create more jobs. Republicans are listening to the American people and have proposed a better solution – the American Energy Act – which will lower gas prices, increase American energy production, promote new clean and renewable sources of energy, and encourage greater efficiency and conservation.”

The full bit Boehner's statement that talks about the drilling decision

Yeah he sure is a crazy person. Out of touch with reality. Commends the step as a good, but insufficient one. Says the GOP bill that goes further as being more in step with public opinion.

What a child!

It's good we agree.

traderdave wrote:

pacino wrote:Sounds like a reasonable approach, though I disagree wtih doing it.

I'm with you, pacino, especially when you hear news reports on supposedly pro-Democrat MSNBC about how when all is said and done tapping 100% of the available oil reserves in the areas opened will yield no more than eight years worth of consumption. I don't know whether that is true or not but it does make you wonder a bit about the efficiency of this approach as opposed to focusing on clean energy. Sadly, I think Obama may just be trying to "buy" GOP support on things he really wants to get done.

I don't know if the "no more than 8 years of consumption" references all of our untapped areas that were off limit prior to this Obama decision, or just the portion that Obama opened up, but minimizing it by saying "no more than 8 years of consumption" is silly.

In 2008 the USA consumed 7.14 billion barrels of oil. A barrel of oil closed today at $84.90. A bit of multiplication shows 7.14 billion barrels of oil costing $606 billion dollars at today's closing price. So like being able to tap into $606 billion dollars would be pretty cool. Nice to not send that monies to the Saudis or Hugo Chavez. If there's 8 years worth, then that's just about $5 trillion worth of oil.

The Nightman Cometh wrote:Its funny because drilling off our shore isn't going to do much in the way of job creation or gas prices. The lack of critical thinking displayed on this issue is mind boggling.

We're a quick-fix society. We don't have the patience for rational solutions.

That bit of conventional wisdom is repeated often, but when exactly do we do anything quickly? In reality, it seems to me that speed and being rational are rarely related.

Who cares about giving the Saudis money anyway? They basically succumb to our desires to the extent their religion allows (most of the time) and their economy is going to dissolve once the oil starts to run dry. They are irrelevent imo.

jerseyhoya wrote:

“The Obama Administration continues to defy the will of the American people who strongly supported the bipartisan decision of Congress in 2008 to lift the moratorium on offshore drilling not just off the East Coast and in the Gulf of Mexico, but off the Pacific Coast and Alaskan shores as well. Opening up areas off the Virginia coast to offshore production is a positive step, but keeping the Pacific Coast and Alaska, as well as the most promising resources off the Gulf of Mexico, under lock and key makes no sense at a time when gasoline prices are rising and Americans are asking ‘Where are the jobs?’

“It’s long past time for this Administration to stop delaying American energy production off all our shores and start listening to the American people who want an “all of the above” strategy to produce more American energy and create more jobs. Republicans are listening to the American people and have proposed a better solution – the American Energy Act – which will lower gas prices, increase American energy production, promote new clean and renewable sources of energy, and encourage greater efficiency and conservation.”

The full bit Boehner's statement that talks about the drilling decision

Yeah he sure is a crazy person. Out of touch with reality. Commends the step as a good, but insufficient one. Says the GOP bill that goes further as being more in step with public opinion.

What a child!

Generally when people really intend to commend something they lead with the commendation.

Also, Boehner IS out of touch with reality re: "job creation!!!1!" from drilling initiatives; you know & I both know pacino is correct about the near-term jobs impact (not much).

Saudis will still get their monies no matter where or how we drill. They may get a tad less, but the fact remains Saudia Arabia is the cheapest place to get crude oil. Crude oil, being a commodity, does not come with a "Made in the USA" or "Thank you for your patronage, sincerely, Osama" label. Production will continue to be concentrated where extraction is cheapest. Just ask Werthless.

Now, if we decided to get all protectionist about oil and banned imports from countries we don't like, that might hurt the Saudis a bit. Of course, we'd have a lot less gas, and we'd probably pay like $15 a gallon at least. People are gonna like that.

Yes the Saudis will get their money no matter what. If we can increase the amount of oil we produce at home, though, we will be able to decrease the amount of money we spend importing oil. Also if we were producing more oil (and increasing our spending on other domestic energy production and energy conservation initiatives) we would possibly have a freer hand in foreign policy to smack sanctions on people and not have to show too much deference to assholes just because they have oil.

traderdave wrote:

pacino wrote:Sounds like a reasonable approach, though I disagree wtih doing it.

I'm with you, pacino, especially when you hear news reports on supposedly pro-Democrat MSNBC about how when all is said and done tapping 100% of the available oil reserves in the areas opened will yield no more than eight years worth of consumption. I don't know whether that is true or not but it does make you wonder a bit about the efficiency of this approach as opposed to focusing on clean energy. Sadly, I think Obama may just be trying to "buy" GOP support on things he really wants to get done.

8 years of oil consumption is huge. Yes it will take a while to come on line, but that is true of any action taken. A nuclear plant started today will be producing a decade from now and we can build a dozen of them and not do more than makeup for the nuke plants that will be retired over that time. Obama is pushing 'clean, renewables' quite hard, but they are starting from an almost insignificant base. Increase their output at a 35% compound annual rate, which is very aggressive, and it takes close to a decade to get up to around 20%. Conservation has the quickest bang and the biggest bang for the buck, but Obama is pushing that very hard, as well. You've got to do all these things. There just isn't the industrial capacity or resource capacity for one or two approaches to come close to solving the problem. The oil development will bring in $ to the government and cut the balance of payments deficit. The renewables will require very large on-going subsidies.

And Boehner is either a big partisan baby or in the pocket of the drillers. Obama is pushing to open up new drilling rates at a faster rate than the industry can actually explore and drill them. To open even more of the offshore areas would just create a glut of offerings that would drive down bidding for lease rates. That would be truly stupid.

Koch Industries

jobs jobs jobs?

What does that graph represent? Where's it from?

Not a challenge - I just can't tell.

Jobs

Barack was so good at being president that he made started the road to recovery before any of his policies were implemented

jerseyhoya wrote:Jobs

Barack was so good at being president that he made started the road to recovery before any of his policies were implemented

The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act became effective in February 17, 2009.