Moyer signs a 2 year deal

by **Trent Steele** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:39:36

Next on Rube's list:

1.) Sign David Eckstein to a 4 year/45 million deal.
2.) Give Utley a golden shower for Christmas.
3.) Sell Wertz to Japan for Brian Mazone.
4.) Pick up 2010 options on Eaton and Jenkins.
5.) Start ripping on Hamels for being "soft"; test market; see if CJ Henry or Omar Daal is available.
6.) Hand out "poop nuggets" instead of WFC rings on Opening Day.
7.) Spend money saved on 1st round pick to install Ruben Amaro, Sr. statute in Ashburn Alley.
8.) Fire Kalas. McCarthy and Wheeler for all 9. TV and Radio.
9.) Require Charlie to manage shirtless.
10.) Sign Chan Ho Park. Oh wait....

by **phorever** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:39:37

so this is real?
wow.
i though it could only be a cruel joke from ek and ftn.
i feared the worst with amaro, while hoping for the best. i thought probably reality would be somewhere inbetween. but no. reality matches my worst expectations.
wow.

the only way we win in 2009 or the foreseeable future is blind-squirrel dumb luck like ruiz doing a johnny estrada 2004 impersonation and happ getting to start after a park injury and turning into rick ankiel pre-freakout.

do my old attempts to blame some of gillick's stranger moves on the involvement of amaro get more credence now?

by **FTN** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:39:44

Brantt wrote:
FTN wrote:as reported by ernie kravitz

I'm setting the 2009 win line at 78. place your bets.

With your track record of excellence, we should all expect 95+ wins now.

Thanks.

Good one.

by **Woody** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:41:25

TWO YEARS FOR 15 MILLY!!! :lol:

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:43:59

Any reason to believe he'd have gotten more than 8 or 9 in arbitration?

Doesn't really look all that much like vomit, does it?

Website · by **Wolfgang622** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:44:54

Trent Steele wrote:Next on Rube's list:

1.) Sign David Eckstein to a 4 year/45 million deal.
2.) Give Utley a golden shower for Christmas.
3.) Sell Wertz to Japan for Brian Mazone.
4.) Pick up 2010 options on Eaton and Jenkins.
5.) Start ripping on Hamels for being "soft"; test market; see if CJ Henry or Omar Daal is available.
6.) Hand out "poop nuggets" instead of WFC rings on Opening Day.
7.) Spend money saved on 1st round pick to install Ruben Amaro, Sr. statute in Ashburn Alley.
8.) Fire Kalas. McCarthy and Wheeler for all 9. TV and Radio.
9.) Require Charlie to manage shirtless.
10.) Sign Chan Ho Park. Oh wait....

by **ucancallmedavis** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:51:37

Does Amaro secretly hate us?

by **Woody** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:53:35

amaro is working for Minaya

by **jerseyhoya** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 15:54:44

I'm having a beer.

by **cshort** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:11:17

Can somebody explain all the Big Unit love on this board? Over that last couple of years, Moyer has been just as good, if not better than Johnson. Based on Moyer's pitching style, his skills probably aren't going to decline as much as Johnson's either. I know the 2 years bothers people, but if you can get a + .500 pitcher that will give you double digit wins, and 180-200 innings, $7.5M/year doesn't seem so bad. Not to mention, he can probably get the Phillies an AARP discount for his hotel room on the road.

by **Barry Jive** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:13:06

so, isn't this probably the last move of the offseason? the payroll's probably at a point where they won't make any more moves until after arbitration hearings, at which point you'd just be giving out minor-league contracts and league minimum salaries.

unless they pull off a trade, these are our 2009 Philadelphia Phillies. Bruntlett at 2B to start the season, Ibanez every day in LF, Moyer and god knows who in the rotation, and almost the same bullpen as last year.

i guess they'll probably still try to trade Coste. whether they package him with someone else and get something of value or not is the question.

by **JFLNYC** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:15:46

Yeah, as I posted in the Park thread, this would bring the payroll over $130MM easily and probably closer to $135MM (depending on arb figures). That's a pretty significant ($30MM/30%) increase over 2008. I can't imagine there are going to be any more signings/trades of significance unless they miraculously find some way to dump significant portions of Jenkins' and/or Eaton's salaries.

by **JFLNYC** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:16:54

It's offical.

by **Werthless** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:17:47

Last 5 years ERA+ starting with 2004 (ERA+ is a league and park-adjusted adjusted measure of ERA. The higher the better, and 100 is set to average):

Moyer: 118, 92, 104, 98, 87
RJ: 117, 123, 90, 112, 177

If you go back further, it enters into Randy's prime, which is to his advantage. Moyer has been league average for the last 5 years. We'll be paying for last year, an aberration. Randy has been better than league average in 4 of the last 5 years.

by **kruker** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:18:04

cshort wrote:Can somebody explain all the Big Unit love on this board? Over that last couple of years, Moyer has been just as good, if not better than Johnson. Based on Moyer's pitching style, his skills probably aren't going to decline as much as Johnson's either. I know the 2 years bothers people, but if you can get a + .500 pitcher that will give you double digit wins, and 180-200 innings, $7.5M/year doesn't seem so bad. Not to mention, he can probably get the Phillies an AARP discount for his hotel room on the road.

Unless you are counting his injured 2007 against him, Johnson is much better than Moyer. Just check this article out:

Moving back to the mound in our series on free agent bargains, we find an interesting name - the tallest player in baseball and a sure fire Hall of Famer, you wouldn’t think Randy Johnson would fly under too many radars. But that’s the state of the game - overemphasis on ERA as a tool to evaluate pitching, and for whatever reason, a premature willingness to put great talents out to pasture.

Sure, Randy Johnson may not be what he once was, but he’s still a pretty terrific starting pitcher. Check out his standing among his peers this year:

8.46 K/9, 6th best in NL
2.15 BB/9, 11th best in NL
3.9 K/BB, 3rd best in NL
3.76 FIP, 15th best in NL

Or, if you prefer, his closest comparable pitcher in the NL this year was Cole Hamels - their walk rates are nearly identical, Johnson’s got a slightly higher K/9, and Hamels has a slightly lower HR/9, but the final product is almost exactly the same. Can you imagine what kind of money Cole Hamels would get if he was a free agent this winter? Now, obviously, there’s a huge age difference, and Johnson’s not going to be pitching for another 10 years like Hamels will be, but their current value is almost identical.

Despite all this, and the fact that he’s unlikely to ask for a long term deal given his age, the D’Backs are still talking about only being interested in Johnson if he takes a significant pay cut. That’s just nutty.

Even if we expect Johnson to regress significantly, giving up about 4.5 runs per nine innings, and only throw 150 innings next year, he’d still be 25 runs above a replacement level starting pitcher. He’s easily worth $10-$15 million a year for a single year, and considering how well he’s fought off decline, a two year deal shouldn’t even be out of the question.

Randy Johnson’s still a pretty terrific pitcher, and teams who just see him as an old guy with back problems are going to miss out.

by **thephan** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:24:41

I am OK with this. I think if Moyer sucks he hangs up his spikes on his own. That does not help if that is mid-season, but I think it is OK. I am less fond of the other moves, and think that the team could have done better. I still hope that there is a front line pitcher named Lowe in the mix.

The quandary is that the team is now spending money, and it is so different that they seem to have amost no idea to to spend it effectively. I wish that Amaro have observed something, anything all those years in baseball.

by **Rococo4** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:25:25

its fine.....moyer has gotten some huge wins

better than chan ho park

by **JFLNYC** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:26:28

ek wrote:
Barry Jive wrote:so, isn't this probably the last move of the offseason? the payroll's probably at a point where they won't make any more moves until after arbitration hearings, at which point you'd just be giving out minor-league contracts and league minimum salaries.

unless they pull off a trade, these are our 2009 Philadelphia Phillies. Bruntlett at 2B to start the season, Ibanez every day in LF, Moyer and god knows who in the rotation, and almost the same bullpen as last year.

i guess they'll probably still try to trade Coste. whether they package him with someone else and get something of value or not is the question.

they are still going to try and get a RH hitter off the bench that can play multiple positions

Ty Wigginton, please!

by **TheCantMan** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:35:41

I'm really happy about this signing.

I think Moyer is a huge asset in the clubhouse. Let's not forget how much of a "pitching coach" he is for the other guys. Yeah, I know we could just make him a pitching coach then and not pay as much, but I believe he's still got stuff.

by **The Red Tornado** » Mon Dec 15, 2008 16:39:51

TheCantMan wrote:I'm really happy about this signing.

I think Moyer is a huge asset in the clubhouse. Let's not forget how much of a "pitching coach" he is for the other guys. Yeah, I know we could just make him a pitching coach then and not pay as much, but I believe he's still got stuff.

I don't mind having Moyer here BUT not at 2 years.

All they had to do was offer arb. He accepts, he gets 7 mil and a one year deal, which is great for both parties. By placing the arb tag on him you prevent him from getting a 2 year deal from anyone including us. No one was going to 2 years for him AND lose a 1st rounder. Ruben f'd it up.

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