Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby jerseyhoya » Thu Nov 13, 2014 21:02:20

drsmooth wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:
drsmooth wrote:
jerseyhoya wrote:Do Democrats on the Hill have members who are in their 40s or 50s?


Republican/reactionary young lions include Marco Rubio, Tom Cotton, Rand Paul, and Joanie Ernst.

I'll take stale, thanks

You prefer Democrats over Republicans? That's really interesting. I'm glad you shared that with us.


So you agree that the chronological ages of leadership really don't make all that much difference when it comes to their capabilities. why do you type so much when you don't actually intend to mean anything?

I think it has an influence in their ability to present new messages and to win over persuadable voters who have drifted away from Congressional Democrats.

I do not think it would change how you vote.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Fri Nov 14, 2014 08:41:17

the loan program which SOLYNDRA!!!!!!!! participated in is turning a profit for the US taxpayer, and helping advance clean energy technologies around the nation. program was never intended to make money, but instead to speed up development of said technologies. BONUS!!
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby Bucky » Fri Nov 14, 2014 09:00:13

REPUBLICAN SENATE CONTINUES TO PAY DIVIDENDS

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Fri Nov 14, 2014 13:30:01

Amy Klobuchar, one ofthe most popular senators in her state in the country, is now in the Senate leadership, along with Elizabeth Warren. Great moves. Also, jh, she's 54, if you care.
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Fri Nov 14, 2014 13:47:38

Boom goes the dynamite:
Don Blankenship, who was chief executive of Massey Energy Co. when its Upper Big Branch coal mine exploded in West Virginia in 2010, killing 29 miners, was charged Thursday with trying to evade mine safety standards and lying to federal regulators.

The explosion April 5, 2010, in the town of in Montcoal was the deadliest U.S. mine accident in 40 years. An investigation by the U.S. Mine Safety and Health Administration in 2011 found that broken equipment failed to douse a small methane gas fire, which ignited coal dust in a giant blast.

The indictment, filed in U.S. District Court in Charleston, West Virginia, charges Blankenship with conspiracy to violate mandatory federal mine safety and health standards, conspiracy to impede federal mine safety officials, making false statements to the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission and securities fraud. It accuses Blankenship of having tipped off managers about federal safety inspections ahead of time before the explosion and of having tried to cover up the company's mismanagement after the explosion.

In a March interview with MSNBC's Chris Hayes, Blankenship denounced the federal investigation and specifically the mine safety agency, saying overregulation had taken safety decisions out of the hands of mining executives.

"What I'm trying to do is prevent other families from suffering," Blankenship said. "And that is what is going to happen if the government doesn't quit running roughshod over the coal mines and give people with expertise the opportunity to run their mines."

Blankenship could face 31 years in prison if convicted on all four counts.

thephan wrote:pacino's posting is one of the more important things revealed in weeks.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby jerseyhoya » Fri Nov 14, 2014 14:28:02

pacino wrote:Amy Klobuchar, one ofthe most popular senators in her state in the country, is now in the Senate leadership, along with Elizabeth Warren. Great moves. Also, jh, she's 54, if you care.

It's still the same three guys in charge. Six people voted against Reid, but no one tried to actually shake the leadership structure up. One lower spot opened up when Begich lost (filled by Klobuchar), and a new role was created under Schumer (Warren).

It is amusing that the Democrats had a majority after the 2006 elections with only six senators in leadership, and now in the minority they've got eight. Trust the Democrats to turn everything they touch into a bloated mess.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby drsmooth » Fri Nov 14, 2014 20:33:02

jerseyhoya wrote:I think it has an influence in their ability to present new messages and to win over persuadable voters who have drifted away from Congressional Democrats.


now if only they can scare up a legitimate, non-misanthropic "message" - I'm assuming that term is meant to stand in for "idea" among the leaders of our New World Order - among them.

I do not think it would change how you vote.


got that right, bubbelah
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby Werthless » Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:20:02

pacino wrote:Amy Klobuchar, one ofthe most popular senators in her state in the country, is now in the Senate leadership, along with Elizabeth Warren. Great moves. Also, jh, she's 54, if you care.

Definitely in the top 2.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:20:40

Werthless wrote:
pacino wrote:Amy Klobuchar, one ofthe most popular senators in her state in the country, is now in the Senate leadership, along with Elizabeth Warren. Great moves. Also, jh, she's 54, if you care.

Definitely in the top 2.

nice catch
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Mon Nov 17, 2014 13:05:45

PA Republicans mulling passing legislation during two week gap until Wolf takes office:
The Pennsylvania Legislature will be led by massive Republican majorities, including the biggest House GOP majority in more than 50 years, when Democratic Gov.-elect Tom Wolf takes office on Jan. 20.

But for two weeks before he takes office, those majorities will be sworn in and intact under outgoing Republican Gov. Tom Corbett, a fact that has not been lost on Republican Party backers.

That means it is possible, albeit technically challenging, to enact far-reaching legislation favored by many Republicans that Corbett might sign, but that Wolf had said during the campaign he would oppose.

People who have looked into it could not find a precedent for such action in modern Pennsylvania political history, but that does not mean it cannot be done.

"I'm sure people would say, 'Gee, we haven't done that before,'" said Gene Barr, president and CEO of the Pennsylvania Chamber of Business and Industry. "There's nothing that prevents them legally from doing that."

Come January, the GOP majorities will be much bigger - 30-20 in the Senate and 119-84 in the House - after a banner legislative election for Republicans. And conservatives say their ranks will be bigger, big enough to pass the key bills over the opposition of Democrats and Republican holdouts.

Asked about getting bills passed before Jan. 20, the man who will become House speaker, Rep. Mike Turzai of Allegheny County, would not directly address it.

"We just got our leadership team together here today. We have much to discuss, although we will hit the ground running," Turzai said last week.

Senate President Pro Tempore Joe Scarnati, R-Jefferson, said there have been no discussions about it between House and Senate GOP leaders, or with Corbett. But, he said, he has been approached by Republican senators and issue lobbyists about the possibility, and he expects it to come up when top Republican lawmakers meet in the coming weeks to discuss strategy in the next legislative session.

A spokesman for Corbett was noncommittal, saying only that the governor would do his job.

"Now there exist the majorities that should allow this type of legislation to pass," said Matthew Brouillette, president and CEO of the Commonwealth Foundation, a Harrisburg-based advocacy group for libertarian and free market ideas.

It's not a 'lame duck' session where the executive is dealing with an outgoing legislature, but an outgoing executive dealing with a new legislature. This would really set things off to a good start between the legislature and Wolf.

BTW, the Commonwealth Foundation is part of the State Policy Network, which is a Koch brothers thing. On the federal level we're not supposed to pass any legislation because 'the voters have spoken', but that possibly doesn't count for the state level where they're able to pass THEIR legislation.
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby dajafi » Mon Nov 17, 2014 14:06:40

Here's the first thing I've read that suggests Elizabeth Warren might really have a shot: Inequality, Unbelievably, Gets Worse

I (somehow) hadn't previously heard that our taxing and spending policies are the true driver of inequality. If you're going to make an argument about the system failing the majority of the population, that's a pretty killer talking point.

Hillary Clinton obviously won't raise this, because she has too much at stake in the status quo. Nor will any Republican, for the same reason. I don't think O'Malley/Carcetti is a good enough politician to do it effectively. Jim Webb might be (and I love Jim Webb), but I don't think any man will be successful against Hillary.

So I think it has to be Warren, and it has to be now--like Obama in 2008, she hasn't been in DC long enough yet for the mutations to take hold. Or maybe Warren and Webb can run in the primaries as a de facto ticket--whichever of us gets the nomination, the other is the running mate.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Mon Nov 17, 2014 14:10:14

that vacation chart is devastating
thephan wrote:pacino's posting is one of the more important things revealed in weeks.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby dajafi » Mon Nov 17, 2014 14:55:45

The more I think about this, the more I believe it would take both Webb and Warren running strong primary campaigns for there to be any chance of a non-Hillary Democratic nominee. Warren takes the sexism charge off the table, while Webb claims a potentially large chunk of the "beer track" Democratic primary electorate.

If they both directed arguments against Hillary, with Warren winning or coming very close in Iowa and Webb doing same in South Carolina (I'm assuming the calendar is more or less unchanged from what it's been, and figuring Clinton is unbeatable in NH, though maybe Warren's geographic proximity gives her a shot), they forestall her locking it up quickly. I think that given enough time, Hillary will blow it: she's not really a natural politician like Bill, though she's been in the bubble so long that she falls short on authenticity compared to Warren, the world's first populist academic, and Webb the soldier/author/journalist who served in the Reagan administration. And "Hillaryland," those hundreds of people who orbit her for power or wealth or whatever, is tougher to govern than the country.

At the least, it would be the best imaginable test of my hypothesis that narrative usually wins in Democratic primary campaigns.

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby CalvinBall » Mon Nov 17, 2014 14:58:42

warren or webb probably couldnt win a general

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Mon Nov 17, 2014 14:58:48

from your keyboard to the political God's ears, dajafi.
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby TenuredVulture » Mon Nov 17, 2014 15:01:55

I think there are a lot of Dems looking for an alternative to Hilary. There was always an element of nostalgia to the Clinton thing (like using a song popular in the 70s for a 90s campaign) and now that nostalgia is reaching back to a time before man voters were alive.
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby TomatoPie » Mon Nov 17, 2014 15:04:43

dajafi wrote:Here's the first thing I've read that suggests Elizabeth Warren might really have a shot: Inequality, Unbelievably, Gets Worse

I (somehow) hadn't previously heard that our taxing and spending policies are the true driver of inequality. If you're going to make an argument about the system failing the majority of the population, that's a pretty killer talking point.


You've misread the charts (or simply misspoken) to think that "our taxing and spending policies are the true driver of inequality." You can argue that our taxing and spending do less to reduce income inequality than does the policy in other nations. But our taxing and spending policies do not exacerbate income inequality.

I like Rattner. Genuine good guy and deep thinker.

Having said that, he bemoans the income gap as though, in and of itself, it's a bad thing. A better question would be how well the folks in the bottom quintile live. And how well the folks in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th quintiles live. Compared to folks in them more equallish nations.

I don't offhand know the answer to that.
Last edited by TomatoPie on Mon Nov 17, 2014 15:08:24, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby dajafi » Mon Nov 17, 2014 15:04:50

CalvinBall wrote:warren or webb probably couldnt win a general


Curious why you think this. Warren is easily caricatured, until she opens her mouth--she tells the key story of this moment better than any Democrat in the country. Webb is strong on that too, and he's culturally difficult to attack: war hero, Republican cabinet member, proud southern white boy.

I don't think he's a great retail campaigner (but few are) and he "disdains the game"--but that can be a strength if done right (which, yes, is another aspect of the game).

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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby pacino » Mon Nov 17, 2014 15:07:36

TomatoPie wrote:
dajafi wrote:Here's the first thing I've read that suggests Elizabeth Warren might really have a shot: Inequality, Unbelievably, Gets Worse

I (somehow) hadn't previously heard that our taxing and spending policies are the true driver of inequality. If you're going to make an argument about the system failing the majority of the population, that's a pretty killer talking point.


I like Rattner. Genuine good guy and deep thinker.

Having said that, he bemoans the income gap as though, in and of itself, it's a bad thing. A better question would be how well the folks in the bottom quintile live. And how well the folks in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th quintiles live. I don't offhand know the answer to that - but mere envy of the superwealthy gets us nowhere.

He spends half the article noting the lack of gains in those 'bottom' 4 quintiles.
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Re: Ink up your Veto Pens this is the POLITICS thread.

Postby TomatoPie » Mon Nov 17, 2014 15:09:46

pacino wrote:
TomatoPie wrote:
dajafi wrote:Here's the first thing I've read that suggests Elizabeth Warren might really have a shot: Inequality, Unbelievably, Gets Worse

I (somehow) hadn't previously heard that our taxing and spending policies are the true driver of inequality. If you're going to make an argument about the system failing the majority of the population, that's a pretty killer talking point.


I like Rattner. Genuine good guy and deep thinker.

Having said that, he bemoans the income gap as though, in and of itself, it's a bad thing. A better question would be how well the folks in the bottom quintile live. And how well the folks in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th quintiles live. I don't offhand know the answer to that - but mere envy of the superwealthy gets us nowhere.

He spends half the article noting the lack of gains in those 'bottom' 4 quintiles.

He spends none of the article comparing our bottom 4 quints to those of the advanced nations of Europe.
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