What if I told you all that my father, grandfather and uncle are/were Masons.

your dad does pipes not bricks you doody head

Philly the Kid wrote: the 12 jews that rule the world

AHA! YOU DO BELIEVE THAT TWELVE GREEDY JOOS RULE THE WORLD!!!!1

You already made that joke once before I think, bucky.

But no I'm serious. There was a masonic service at my uncle's funeral last month

sorry to hear that

did he live at 801 ridge

Philly the Kid wrote:It's not always a matter of making stories to fit things and connecting dots that shouldn't be.... that's a super over-simplification of reality Doc.

It's not really an oversimplification of the human condition. I'm sorry you can't grasp the philosophical implications; that may be due to your looking outside yourself for causes.

Speaking of conspiracies.........watching the actual Frost-Nixon interview on WHYY. I would like to have heard Nixon work in a pizza place or something, cause man, can he drone and talktalktalk.
"The sausage could be your best option; sausage is delicious, and the only thing I would say is that it's not exceptionally nutritious. But there was a time I was visited by my doctor, and I feel comfortable revealing this, and he told me you shouldn't have sausage too often because your arteries will eventually clog. Now, I've always been of a mind that a man can make his own, educated choices. I have known people to subsist on sausage-like meats and cheese-filled breads, staples of Eastern European diets, and live long, healthy, vibrant lives. But I can also certainly recognize how someone in your position might heed the advice of medically trained personnel, those who have done research and are steeped in knowledge. In that case you might opt for peppers or plain cheese. Maybe even a tomato pie. But I would ask that you contemplate the choices and look inside yourself for the answers."

Harpua did you used to be some other poster that we're all familiar with? I just want to be sure you're eligible for the best new poster and comedic fresh face Wheelie awards

Nope, I have never had another handle here, nor is this a (admittedly nondescript) sockpuppet. I am flattered. Yay, awards.

Woods, that sig is gonna freak me out for as long as you have it.

I don't know what it means, and I don't care to think about it--or indeed any other bit of nonsense from PtK, who's long since forfeited the privilege of my taking him seriously or even, to be honest, reading his spew.

So, quick, someone else write something dumber. Please.

There's a reason why the memberlist button looks like a can of sardines. They have us all packed in together, right where they want us.

And the key seems to have been conveniently misplaced.




Excuse me, I hear someone coming.

It's postmodern pablum

dajafi wrote:Gosh, what a shock that a serious discussion about an interesting topic has been hijacked by PtK and his usual fecal typhoon.

All I'll say is that there's a definitional gap between hidden malfeasance of the sort that investigative journalism is supposed to reveal (and which, I fear, will become far more manifest and harmful as traditional media continues to shrivel up and die) and "the world is controlled by twelve Jews who live in Zurich."

Investigative journalism is looking at how certain politically connected American companies have war-profiteered (legally and/or otherwise) in this decade. Conspiracy theorizing is stating the belief that the wars themselves had the primary purpose of allowing those companies to profit.

Well I do think that it's sometimes a question of what you name it. Some people would say Cheney enabling Haliburton's thievery is conspiracy, while others just see that as criminal or immoral behavior. Someone pointing out that they don't think the official story of 9/11 is true can be labelled a conspiracy nut, but maybe that person just doesn't think the whole official story is true -- iow, some information has been left out to make the whole thing more simple for Americans to understand and/or to focus our ire where they want it to be focused. That's very different than saying Bush planned 9/11 so he could attack Iraq. It's a matter of degree. I would want to find out what the 1st person believed before labeling him a nutjob, while the 2nd person is most likely paranoid or gullible. The problem is that they are grouped together by a lot of people (not just talking about 9/11, but a lot of things), and are dismissed as crazy because it's simpler for the labeler to make a quick judgement. That's just as stupid as saying Bush planned 9/11, imho.

Anyway, I'd like to see the term disappear from the language and each argument judged on its merits rather than people labeled and dismissed so easily -- again, not talking about 9/11, but all the more mild beliefs that get grouped with conspiracy ideas. It's a loaded word that's thrown around to immediately rebuff ideas without addressing the merits of the argument. It's ad hominem. For example, I think there's a reason why Cheney blocked the release of the energy hearings. They had something to hide, most likely. But that's a far cry from 12 jews controlling the world.

But more to the broader question originating the thread, I think conspiracy ideas have grown for a few reasons. One, the internet allows for the quick exchange of information without critical review, and this information is often given too much weight because it seems to be more official than it really is. I also think there is a growing feeling of powerlessness among many people, and these people don't have the interpersonal opportunities that they used to have. When you feel powerless, it's easy to blame others and try to find grand schemes responsible for your isolation and lack of power.

The Dude wrote:

The article was released before analysis conducted by BYU physics Professor Steven Jones discovered traces of thermite in steel samples taken from the World Trade Center.

zOMG!!! It was TERMITES!!! STEEL-EATING MUTANT TERMITES!!!

Well, what daya know. Apparently, Occam actually did have a razor...

Our minds are built to perceive order. We're inherently uncomfortable with the idea that things are arbitrary. People are religious because they're more comfortable with the notion that everything happens for a reason and God has a plan than they are with the fact that things are arbitrary. People would rather believe that the government (or the Jews or corporations or whoever) planned everything than accept the true randomness of the world.

It's the same reason that some people believe that sports outcomes are never the result of happenstance. When you watch games you see how arbitrary the outcome sometimes is. Yet, after the fact, people say that it was inevitable. Team A won the championship because their ownership was committed to building a winning team. Their players wanted it. Their star players are winners. Team B lost because they lack all those things.

Harpua wrote:Nope, I have never had another handle here, nor is this a (admittedly nondescript) sockpuppet. I am flattered. Yay, awards.

don't believe the lies, man. That's how he sucks you in.

ashton wrote:Our minds are built to perceive order. We're inherently uncomfortable with the idea that things are arbitrary. People are religious because they're more comfortable with the notion that everything happens for a reason and God has a plan than they are with the fact that things are arbitrary. People would rather believe that the government (or the Jews or corporations or whoever) planned everything than accept the true randomness of the world.

It's the same reason that some people believe that sports outcomes are never the result of happenstance. When you watch games you see how arbitrary the outcome sometimes is. Yet, after the fact, people say that it was inevitable. Team A won the championship because their ownership was committed to building a winning team. Their players wanted it. Their star players are winners. Team B lost because they lack all those things.

That's a poor analogy.

There is an inherent bias by most in this thread, that those of us who do not eat at the trough of the mainstream media, and conform to some guidelines of what you (relatively few) deem " sane" are somehow gullible, naive, extreme, needing to contrstuct narratives, believing in boogeymen and whatever else more offensive labelings have been doled out.

I stated two main reasons for why I and many others may believe that the world is full of deception and corruption and lies. No one here yet, has refuted those statements.

They were my opinions.

I try to respond to most reasonable comments, and some of the unreasonable I'm growing weary of responding to personal attacks and mis-characterizations -- and thread after thread deterioriating in to some p-t-k against the world situation.

I've said it before, I'll say it ongoing -- we do not live in an egalitarian society. There is not equal representation, nor fair play in most spheres in life. Laws are manipulated, broken and whether its Supreme Court Justices, Senators, or Presidents -- there are things that happen not for the reasons publicly stated. Much is dis-ingenuous. Many times, they are doing the bidding of some political or class interest -- and it has nothing to do with fair, honest, right or wrong. I think most of you know that, see that -- and some of you just accept it, or contend that's not a big deal, no big revelation. Some of you think that any suggestion that evil doing goes on, that anything can be planned and conceived of ahead of time -- or that big things can happen in seemingly plain view, is absurd -- is simply wishiful thinking on your parts.

I've been clear in 90% of what I've stated. I'm still waiting for anyone to refute anything I've said with any substance or merit. INcluding Dajafi -- who says he refrains from reading anytihg I spew and has lost pretty much all credibility he ever had with me, by turning it personal and completely avoiding the very reasonable things I say most of the time and in this thread.

Are conspiracies going on?

Corruption goes on. False flag military initiatives. Demonizing countries goes on. Unfair and undue influence from corporate lobbyists goes on. Toxic food, water, air, culture goes on. These things are real, and have a bearing on our lives.

I may not have all the answers, but I have a lot of very reasonable question and concerns. And I can see how inequity and injustice prevail. Conspiracy exists on small levels as well as large. A DA decides to make a statement and conspires to treat a defendant differently than others in the same boat. It can be that small. It can be as large as JFK, 911, or invading Iraq.

So we agree, it's a self esteem thing then?